FG Piper Cub tutorial

[JR.]

Wad Cutter a fellow member is having trouble building the Fiddlers Green Cub so I decided to do a tutorial on how to build it.

I have already finished the wings.

[Vermin_King]

Is the build essentially the same for any of the sizes?

[Wad Cutter]

Tim, I thought I had it but still I don't. The wings came out just fine but the center wing section is unclear. My wing looks just like yours from the top but it's hoe you treat the underneath of the CWS. Do you remove all the card with in the window and the picture of of the Piper Cub leaving the yello of the edge? Sorry to be so stupid. I just don't understand. I might be best if I post some photos of my own. wc/waddy

[Wad Cutter]

Jr. This is what I did. Is this correct?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v233/Wad_Cutter/2012-04-11_11-46-33_819.jpg

[JR.]

I'm sorry W.C. but I can only see images done through the manage attachments thing. V.K. I shrunk the large B&W model to 50% so that I save card stock and ink. It is a little more difficult to build but still fun.:)

Got the fuselage nearly completed I glued the part for the windows to the inside of the fuselage. I also added the wing profile to it so that it covers up the open part of the wings.

[Wad Cutter]

Jr. I hope you can see my photo now. I had no idea this was possible to post a photo this way.

[JR.]

yes that looks good.

[Wad Cutter]

Hi Jr. Looking at the top of my aircraft over the cabin, I can see that yours is different as if you cot away the windows and frames. Did I take a wrong turn? waddy john

[JR.]

no that's good I fact I had to redo it a little I'll post some pictures soon.

[Wad Cutter]

When I look at your I see the top of the cabin removed. I just don't understand why and how much to cut or do I go ahead and glue the top of the cabin. Thank you Jr. waddy/john

[JR.]

John,
Sorry it took so long, but I hope this will help you out. :)

[Wad Cutter]

My seats came out ok, I think. I need to buy a felt pen set to color the places I didn't cut to well or redo the seats. You have been a hug help. Don't go any where I know there will still be questions. I think I'm hooked on the card modeling thanks to you and everyone else s help. Thank you Jr. wc

[JR.]

Wow It's been over two weeks since my last post. It's because I'm working on something else which I'll let everyone know about soon. I've got a little left to go so I'll try getting it finished soon.

[Wad Cutter]

I continue struggle with this build. I have had to go back and do a few do-over’s. I noticed that your window frame looks more strengthen as mine looks more bent up from handling so much. My cockpit came out ok or at least I’m satisfied with it. I was going to cut out the windows(to right of aircraft laying on table) next and us Scotch for the glass but with the frame already attach how do I apply the other windows to the frame of the fuselage? This is so confusing or I am so stupid. wc

[JR.]

Yeah I usually laminate the frame a few times for strength. I just thought of something you could also maybe use toothpicks to strengthen them.
When I did the grasshopper version, I used a Ziploc sandwich bag for the windows but they are thin. Maybe you could try using one of those freezer bags they're a bit thicker, or use clear packaging tape. Hope these ideas help.

[Wad Cutter]

What do you use to laminate the window fame? First time I have heard of this. Can I still laminate my frame work to save it or do I have to start over again? I found a youtube on window making but I would like to get a second opinion first.
FiddlersGreen.net Clear Canopies Tutorial - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKmJJXXKS9g&feature=player_embedded)
There is a lot more to card stock modeling then I ever thought. Some where thee has to be a "Idiot's Guide to Card Stock Modeling". This is so far over my head it's on a different planet. This Piper Cub might not have been the best model to start with. Maybe a cube or something. Crap!!!

[JR.]

Laminating is where you layer multiple parts together to make it thicker. You don't have to redo it just glue another frame over the one you have one there. You could do some searching around the links area of the forum. There should be some websites that has some basics on card modeling. When I first started this hobby I was doing worse then you but practice makes perfect.

[Wad Cutter]

With the aircraft sealed up now it will be impossible to laminate the window frame. I should have done that from the inside when the model was open. No where in any of the builds of aircraft did I see or hear of this but it make sense or print the model out on a thicker card stock if my printer could take it. Looks like I have a lot of reading and a lot of printing to do. Thanks for all your help. Holly smoke. wc

[Wad Cutter]

When you say laminat the window frame are you suggesting cutting the other window frame into useable sections and clue those on. Such as the left and right side separately without using the entire window over the cabin window? Jr., I'm trying to understand this. At first I thought you meant from inside which is now sealed p. Or did you mean something else? Thank oyu for all your help. wc

[JR.]

Yes that is how I did it. Have you already made the windows? If not you may still be able to put it on the inside.

[Wad Cutter]

Not alot of room for me finger to work if you see my photo. What are you suggesting? I thought I would cut the window I cut all the windows out of and cut in into section and use one part on my side and the other part on the other side to add stringent. Then make the windows like the Youtube video and place it over . Any thoughts?

[JR.]

I will try to show you how to do it. It will probably be Monday when I'll be able to post what I've done.

[Wad Cutter]

No worries Tim. I got some advise from Billygoat on how he did his L-5. One problem I see now is how to make the glass wind screen for the front to wrap around and up and over. I'll start over on one problem at a time. Learning curve is what is going on here. Thank you Jr. wc

[Wad Cutter]

I had to cut her open which is a easy fix. Next step will be the glass after she dries. willy from FG gave me the idea and a lot of help as did you Jr. Thank you.. I won't have to start over again. I'm a happy boy.

[JR.]

That looks very good. keep at it.

[Wad Cutter]

I redid the fuselage by using sticky paper and have it cut out after being told it's easier to apply windows to a flat surface. I will do the same for cockpit to make it strong. I also used stick paper for the window frame. So now it's time to fasten the plastic for the windows. There are so many different glues I'm not sure which one is strong enough but will allow me to place a bend to the window frame work. The sky light section has me baffled as it has to have more of a roll up and over the frame work of the cockpit area. Any suggestion which glue? Strong but apply able if you understand what I mean? Once again, I want to thank one and all for the over pouring amount of help. Especially you Jr..

[JR.]

I don't know what glue to use. I do have some quick setting glue that might work. But it likes to leave a white residue on clear plastic. I'll try working on it some more this evening.

[Wad Cutter]

A friend suggested a glue he uses all the time on canopy's. Formula 560. I haven't use it myself yet. I had to go to a hobby store for it. I'll use it today and see how it works and let you know. willy has been helping also with the windows so I'm not flying blind but it's still a unclear night to be flying in. That and being lost doesn't help. waddy/john

[Wad Cutter]

This is where I am so far today. The windows are done and they will be glued of the outside of the fuselage. I am redoing that today. I used a special glue I got from a hobby store. Formula 560 Canopy Glue by Pacers. Is this what you had in mind or did you mean to glue the windowd to the inside. That would still leave the problem on how to deal with the from window and the skylight. waddy.

[JR.]

Well I got the windshield finished I think I got the parts to thick around the windshield area. Because the windshield wouldn't fit right.

[Wad Cutter]

Hi Jr.,Does it matter that I still have a cross bar on my windows separating the windshield for the top skylight window? Skylight because I didn't know what else to call it. What glue did you you use to glue the windows frame to the fuselage? I finished the cockpit area yesterday and this time I like it.Thanks Fr.

[JR.]

It doesn't matter if the cross brace is there. I used Testers glue for gluing the windshield it worked very well. one more thing be sure you wait till one side is finished gluing or you will have trouble.

[JR.]

I just noticed that you bent the front of the seats down. That's a good idea. I don't know why I didn't think of that.

[Wad Cutter]

If you look at the leading edge of the seat there is a line. I thought that was the way it was supposed to be. Looks I did something right huh? I'm going to pit a little bit of cotton in the vertical and horizontal stabilizers to give them a puffed out look not a flat surface. I got some tin but strong wire from the hardware store that I will use in the tail wheel to add some stringent and the side foot support. I'm reading everything I can. There are so many tips but there are not all in the same place. Today I will redo the body and glue the cockpit inside and get that as ready as I can. I'm still thinking about the wings. I printed them out. I never was happy with the first pair. A lot of this is thanks to you Jr. I wouldn't have gotten this far with you and the help of others.

[JR.]

The next part I'll be working in is the wheels. I'll be using my role-up tires. I think that they're easier to build then the ones that F.G. offers.

[Wad Cutter]

"role-up tires" ??? I thought the one that came with the model were called rill up tires. The thing I didn't like about the tires that come with the model is they are flat on the bottom. It will work but doesn't look that good.

[JR.]

It is in the file of the Continental engine I designed. PaperModelers.com - Downloads - Continental A-40 (http://www.papermodelers.com/forum/downloads.php?do=file&id=1409) they look a whole lot better then FGs

[Wad Cutter]

I had this but until now didn't really know what it was. Still don't understand how it all goes together. The engine looks beyond me. I hope your going to go over all of this. Do you just cut out the wheel strips and roll up to make a solid wile? The srtuts I will have to play with the get what youur trying to do. I've stuck with you this long I might just as well take the whole trip. Still working on the fuselage. I didn't get to spend the time I wanted to on her today. Thank you Jr. or should I be calling you Timothy? See ya, waddy/john

[JR.]

Yes you roll them into solid wheels. I will show you how to do them and the struts. I'm going to make the tires thicker so they're more like tundra tires.
You can call me Timothy or by my middle name James or for short Tim Jim. It doesn't matter to me.:)

[JR.]

Well I hope this helps you out. I'd suggest that when you do the landing gear struts that you use quick setting glue when putting parts together. Also with the tires maybe use a fine file or sand paper smooth out the tire shape. I added the tundra tires to the list of photos.

[Wad Cutter]

Wow, I'm going to have to go over this a few times before I understand. You can sand the paper tires to get them smooth? What grade sand paper do I need? I have the 65 lb paper and the glue. I was hoping for the large tundra tires. Is this last sheet of strips(tires) the same one you had in the engine download or is this a newer one? Sorry to be so dumb Jr. I'm trying, really I am. I'll get it. waddy/john

[JR.]

Sandpapering does help make it smooth. It is also because the last part kind of makes the outer part look strange I made a cross section picture to show what I mean.
65 lb. cardstock does work best for the landing gear and wheels.
the last picture is the tundra tires I designed I'll put pictures on soon of how they look on the cub.
It is alright it's taken me a long while to learn how to do these models fairly well. it just takes patience. "if at first you don't succeed, try, try again." :)

[Wad Cutter]

Sorry to be on the slow side of the uptake on this. Did you use card stock on the wheels and landing gear or standard paper? On the tires. Start with part 1 and roll tight. Where it ends glue part 2 and then all the way though part 5. Last part is 6 glues down the center pf tire.
.Allow to dry and sand, right? I have noticed the part 2 is wider. Does that matter?
It's not easy when I have been out of modeling for more then 20 yrs. Following detailed instructions and trying to see what you want me to see and hoping I do. Once I have this then other tires will become a lot easier.
My biggest problem I have is when I find a mistake and need to go back a few steps. Then I have to catch up. Thanks Tim, I really need your understanding on this. waddy

PS-would you be interested in a more real instrument panel? I don't know how to send it to you because it's larger then allows.
Did you use the "Fuselage Cross Section"? I thought because we are installing the cockpit and seats it wasn't necessary or is it?

[JR.]

It is best to use 65lb. card stock for both landing gear and wheels. You got the instructions on the tires right.
Take your time. Its suppost to be a hobby not a project that has a dead line.
yes I would like to have the instrument panel.

[Wad Cutter]

Yorr right, it's a hobby. One that has come to really taken my life over and that's ok. Not a day goes by I don't get an idea or see a new exciting model or hear of a way to doing something. This is a never ending hobby that allows me to get closer to the aircraft I have come to know and fly with friends at night. It's a royal hoot. Back to printing out the wheels and doing some cutting and gluing. Thank Tim. No hurry, no rush just pure enjoyment. I think I have the bug. wc

[Wad Cutter]

What about the "Fuselage Cross Section"?

[JR.]

What about the "Fuselage Cross Section"?
I tried using it before it works, but it doesn't really matter.
About the instrument panel you could ether make it smaller by using a program like windows paint. Or you create a .zip file (it is done by right clicking the file you want then go to "send to" [depending on the computer] then find the icon that say something like 'compressed (zipped) folder' click on that. Then you could add it to the downloads section of the forum.

[Wad Cutter]

I tried wind zip and rar but still too big.
This is the only way I know other then e-mailing.
file:///J:/Fiddlersgreen/1A%20FiddlerGreen%20Storage/Piper%20Cub%20J-3UPDATED!%204-18-2012/Piper%20L4H/PhotoDetails.asp.htm (file:///J:/Fiddlersgreen/1A%20FiddlerGreen%20Storage/Piper%20Cub%20J-3UPDATED%21%204-18-2012/Piper%20L4H/PhotoDetails.asp.htm)

[Wad Cutter]

Were you able to see and use the panel I sent in last message? First tire complete. I have to wait for it to dry before I can sand it. Getting the first roll started was a bear due to my fat fingers. Last strip was hard to cut out and gluing to center of tire not easy but I'm happy with what I'm doing and I think that's the trick. Being happy. waddy/john

[Wad Cutter]

Can I ask how you ever thought of doing the tires like this? Looking at where one strip is more morrow at a certain give the tire a feather. Tim, this far from easy. It's one thing to to make but it's a lot harder to teach. Something so small but yet so much detail. Wow!!! Thank you. wc

[JR.]

Well I wasn't able to get the panel. I was wondering if this it is on the fiddlersgreen website.
I can't remember how I thought of doing these tires like this. I guess as that saying goes necessity is the mother of invention.
I know of a tip that other people use for rolling paper they glue a piece of wire or even a toothpick to the beginning of the roll. Probably use a strong type of glue not anything like Elmer's craft glue but maybe testers glue will work when it is fully dry.
I hope this might help you out.

[Wad Cutter]

First I curled the paper with a ruler. Then I use very small, thin needle pliers and made a small tight curl in the til end of the paper. Removed the pliers and added a small amount of glue. From there it was just making a tight wheel.
As for the panel, it was something a friend found for me that came from the real aircraft and he made it to the correct scale.
I'll have to work on a way to get it to you. wc

[Wad Cutter]

Today the tires such as they are complete other then the sanding and coloring. Some how mine came out much differently from you Tim. How hard could that have been. Just roll it up and shape as you go and then I guess I am to sand them down smooth, right? Once done with that I was going to color them wirth a permanent marker

[JR.]

well your tires will look better after the sanding and coloring. sometimes when the glue is still wet i would of roll the tire in my fingers or on the table to make it nice and round.
keep up the good work.

[JR.]

I ask that you wait on the rear tire I need to do some work on it. I'll try getting it done tomorrow.

[Wad Cutter]

Sorry Tim, did I say something wrong?

[JR.]

No you didn't. I just wanted to warn you that the rear wheel needed some work done on it.

[Wad Cutter]

Today was not a good day for me. I made to undercarrage and thought I did a good job. I had set it aside to dry. Later on I found it on the floor. I had run my chair over it and it's can't be saved. I am starting to rebuild it again. Not good. waddy/john

[JR.]

That's awful, but at least it was a good practice try.
Well I had completely forgotten about readjusting the rear tire till about a couple hours ago and finally got it done. Just build it the same as the front tires.

[Wad Cutter]

Rebuilding the undercarriage and then rear tires. I hope it wasn't cheating buy using a Dremel Drill (http://www.google.com/aclk?sa=l&ai=CwkfwC1W1T7azNYO7sQK0k82SA4TSjMECvN-M5ySUmJGIXggCEAIoAlDWrPfuA2DJvtmGyKOgGaABwMiW8APIA QeqBB1P0ChGRvgs8p-cTqnNzsMm59mxJOFJUj_xv23AdboFEwiWx53HioiwAhUpzLYKH V9dbATABQXKBQCgBiY&ei=C1W1T9aVAamY2wXfurEj&sig=AOD64_0q2D7h-jn2mTHUaV9L-1ZO3kSXWA&ctype=5&sqi=2&ved=0CBgQww8&adurl=http://www.wayfair.com/Dremel-Drill-Press-220-01-220-01-OEO1122.html%3Frefid%3DGPA49-OEO1122&rct=j&q=dremel+rotary+drill) to do the sanding of the tires. I use two different sandpapers. I haven’t attached the wing to the fuselage as of yet. I was thinking of rebuilding the wings and use wing spares to get the form of the wing correctly. I have the spares but they are not the same scale and so I might just go with what I have. Like I said before, this is my first of what I hope will be many more models and wanted to it to look good. That’s why it’s taking so long.

The last photo was another idea I had for do the tires. It failed. waddy/john

[JR.]

You're suppose to do it the hard way. just joking.:) looks good. why did you use rubber o-rings for tires?

[Wad Cutter]

The rubber o-ring was just a crazy idea. I rolled the paper like you did but use a tool to spin and sand. Or would it been better to hand sand them do you think? Still a lot to bo yet. Not a race, right?

[JR.]

yep, looks good. if I would have thought of it I would have used a dremel tool.
I saw that link that Dremel Drill Press. that is awesome. my dad only has a hand Dremel tool.

[Wad Cutter]

That's what I have. A friend on mine(Bob) did a set of tires he needed and that's how I found out about it. I clued 20 pieces of card stock 1110 together and sanded it down the size and shape he needed. I went your way to make the wheel and then sanded it down. What link are you talking about? I didn't see that one. I took the day off from modeling today and got into some other things. Lazy day today. Back to the grind tomorrow. Some time over weekend I have to mow the front lawn.

[Wad Cutter]

I've been away from my model for a few day so this morning I glues the wings in and look what I now have. Is this a mess or is this screed up? This Piper Cub is going to take for ever. I guess I'll start ALL over again and try to correct my mistakes. If I can find them. I just don't beleave this.

[JR.]

Well my first few tries were very bad. They could have been considered tape models because I was using tape to hold them together. So don't feel so bad. Practice and Experience is the key.

[Wad Cutter]

I found something fo cut wheel better I think. Gluing as many thicknesses of paper as need then use this tool to cut the size. From there is't just a mater of sanding with the drill.
Rotary Circle Cutter (CMP-3)
1-1/2" to 8-3/4".
Welcome to Olfa (http://www.olfa.com/CircleCuttersDetail.aspx?C=50&Id=149)

Or am I getting to lazy?

[Wad Cutter]

It’s a long ways from good but I can live with this one. Have you had a chance to make that tutorial for building your engine yet? I keep looking at your photos and I just can't see it yet. I've been working on other aspects of the plane after taking a break from her. I can't make out the detail in your photos of your engine. Thank you Tim. I really appreciate all your help on this bird. How’s the 109 or did you say you were going to start on a P-51? Been a while since I have heard from you. waddy/john

[JR.]

I'll finish the small model of the cub I'm doing then I need to finish a model of butler class destroyer escort for Phigmint a fellow member then I'll get to work on one of those projects.
what you can do with the nose of your cub for now is: lightly glue it to the rest of the fuselage, then when I get to doing the engine you can take off the nose, so that you don't have to do it all over again.

[Wad Cutter]

Today was going to be the day to glue the wing in but as you can see there seems to be something wrong. Ti me the wing sits to forward and why is there so much white around the wing showing. Is this the way it's suppose to be? I got the nose worked out just waiting for the engine. As this is my first model I know expect to have several part of the model not correct but this is a lot ore then I thought.Wold you happen to have any idea how many times I'm suppose to chuck this model away and start over again? I am not very happy with what I have made. waddy

[JR.]

If you could take a picture from behind and above the model, so that I can see how the wing goes into the slot in the fuselage, I might be able to see what went wrong.

[Wad Cutter]

I think the solution is to trim away a small amount of trailing center wing section at a time till the wing fits correctly and the windows appear to fit correctly when help against the fuselage.
Tim, how many times have you wanted to place your model in the fireplace and set to it? How many times have you done it? waddy

[Wad Cutter]

Here's a different angle.

[JR.]

Maybe this will work.

[Wad Cutter]

Thanks Tim, that was what I was thinking. Only cutting a little at a time and check for fit. I've been hold off till I heard from you. We'll get this puppy, it's just a matter of time. Thank you. waddy

[willygoat]

hey there Waddy,
I looked over the pics you sent me and I think I figured out the problem. You have the wings build with a beautiful curved leading edge. however, the wings also seem to have a curved underside as well. The Cub had a nearly flat under-wing surface. When I built my L-4, I actually scored the line on the leading edge from where the flat bottom stops and the airfoil shape starts. Doing that will help keep the wing flat for attachment to the fuselage. Not that you really want to build another wing again :rolleyes:

[Wad Cutter]

I tried to build the wing with your spars. I clued in a few on each wing side off of center . Then I flipped the wing up and over just going for a fit and the wing didn't fit. Not matter what I did or tried, those spars wouldn't fit. I reprinted the wings again with out the spars trying to fold the cure into the leading edge. I toof a couple of spares and cut them in half and fit them into the wing right at the center opening to get the flat into the wing at the middle. I have to tell you guys, this is a lot harder then pulling teeth and once I had to do it. wad

[Wad Cutter]

Hot off the press. This is the wing upside down show how flat the wing is. Do you still think it has to much curve on the underneath side?

[JR.]

looks good to me.

[Wad Cutter]

Wings glued and drying. Working on engine add on part and still have to do the front dash and fuel tank. Had no idea about where the engine baffles or exhaust pipes went so I visited willys Grasshopper on FG forum and there it was. Little by little I guess.