Beta builder for Ares I rocket

[APA-168]

I need a beta builder for the upcoming Ares I kit. Scale is 1/144. The kit is very simple, and requires few special skills. The only thing to know is that it is round, so if you are adverse to curves this is not your kit :D It should stand about 2ft tall when finished. Let me know here and I'll e-mail the parts to you tomorrow. :)

[willygoat]

Ares I as in the new rocket for NASA? Hmmmmm. What's the time frame?

[APA-168]

Yes, the very same. There's no specific time frame as long as its "reasonable." ;) Wanna give it a go?

[lee4752]

I'm in the process of building Ton's Ares I from The Lower Hudson Valley Paper Model Giftshop at http://jleslie48.com/index.html Original is 1:96. I scaled down to near 1:144 (printed at 67%). Colors are sort of washed out a little when I reduced it. I wouldn't mind giving it a go. I only started the Constellation Project rockets while waiting for the next ISS section from Ser Alfonso at Welcome to AXM Paper Space Scale Models (http://www.axmpaperspacescalemodels.com/index.html) , the Mobile Base system for Canadarm2 - STS-111.

[willygoat]

Sure, what the hay! I've been looking for a model of this rocket for the museum i work at. Yippee!.

[Matthew From Florida]

Cool... I plan to build an Ares model in the near future, likely one off The Lower Hudson Valley Paper Model Giftshop website:D.

[lee4752]

I started the beta build with the first stage SRB engine nozzle (1st photo). Second photo shows most of the remaining parts of the SRB with the upper part rolled and glued into a cylinder. I made my own glue tabs internal to the cylinder, since I'm so poor at edge glueing.

[lee4752]

The first stage is about done. I just need to add the fairing to the second stage, the instrumentation duct, some stripes around the lower portion of the SRB, and a few fiddly little bits around the engine cone. Next, the second stage.

[lee4752]

It may me the 67 lb paper I used, but the stripes that go around the lower SRB are about 1/16 inch too short. It's not very noticeable once the instrumentation duct is in place. Well, that's what a beta build is for. Finding opportunities for improvement, that is. Over all, I have to say this is a very well designed model. I think I'll have to invest in one of Shrike's Rolly Sticks after this build. A narrow diameter 8 inch long rod would have been just the thing for helping to join the edges of the cylinders.

[lee4752]

Here's stage 2. Just the upper parts left. I think it's a test capsule. Avery didn't design the Orion spacecraft yet for this beta. There is an escape tower on top, but it doesn't match the tower pictures I've seen for Orion.

[APA-168]

Here's my reference for the Ares. It's an official NASA site, with the latest update to the rocket design. That's what I incorporated into my design. The version your thinking of is closer to the Ares I-X, the test version, which is my next model.

Safe, Simple and Soon (http://www.safesimplesoon.com/media-images.htm)

I'm not sure quite what to do about the Orion. There are so many Orion models already out there, but I'd like to have one for the model. Any ideas?

By the way, your doing an absolutely fantastic job, it looks great.

It may me the 67 lb paper I used, but the stripes that go around the lower SRB are about 1/16 inch too short. It's not very noticeable once the instrumentation duct is in place. Well, that's what a beta build is for. Finding opportunities for improvement, that is. Over all, I have to say this is a very well designed model. I think I'll have to invest in one of Shrike's Rolly Sticks after this build. A narrow diameter 8 inch long rod would have been just the thing for helping to join the edges of the cylinders.

Thanks for that, and thank you for the compliment. :) I just have to mention that it's #5 on the bestsellers list on ecardmodels.com :D I made some changes to the framing so the production version will be easier to assemble. :)

[lee4752]

Oh! I guess that means it's done. If the photo looks like it's leaning or bent a little, that's because it is. Entirely my fault. the kit is well designed. My execution was a little off. It's not so far off that it won't stand up, so I guess it's a keeper. My son thinks so anyway. He just appropriated it.
Avery,
I hope the production model has part G6, the top cone on the escape tower moved in a little. It was too close to the margin and about 3/8 inch was cut off. I fixed it with a compass and ruler, but moving the part over a little would be better. One thing I'd definitely suggest is to remove the grey background. It just uses a lot of ink for scrap. Also, I suggest making some of the lines narrower if you can. I'm one of those who get confused about where to cut.
The bottom row of photos on the web link you referenced shows Orion configured with Ares I. Ton Noteboom has an Orion kit (actually, 2 versions) on The Lower Hudson Valley Paper Model Giftshop (www.jleslie48.com (http://www.jleslie48.com)). It's 1/96 scale I think. It can be reduced 66% to get approximately 1/144 scale. A new fairing from the top of the second stage (where the orange ends) would have to be designed to accommodate the Orion.
I'm not absolutely sure, but I think the production launch vehicle (the real rocket, that is) has the logos, flag, and "United States" on both sides.

[lee4752]

Here's Ton's latest Orion design from the Lower Hudson Valley Paper Model Giftshop reduced to 67%. That brings it as close as I can get it to 1/144 scale. Original design is 1/96 scale. I just have a half dozen itty bitty vernier rocket motors left to go on it for the main structure, then there's another kit for the launch escape system. the Command Module and Service Module come apart, but are very stable when joined together. I chose not to install the solar panels at this scale, since I'm planning to have the spacecraft on top of the Ares I launch vehicle. I'll probably do another Orion, possibly at 1/100 scale to fit in with the ISS. That would just be a reduction to 96% in case anyone's keeping score.

[lee4752]

I finished my 1:144 scale Orion to go on my next attempt at the Ares I rocket. I reduced Ton's LES to 67% and printed it after inverting it. I noticed the crew hatch was on the opposite side of the instrumentation duct from where it is in reference photos and on his Command Module kit. Well. I guess mistakes happen ... except to me , of course.:D I also added a tiny US flag to the LES cone opposite the crew hatch as it appears in reference photos.

[cgutzmer]

nice looking build!

[lee4752]

Here's a new attempt at the ARES I. I traced over some of Avery's kit to get the logos & emblems on both sides and I'm bashing it together with some of Ton's kit parts. I also redrew the fairing above the second stage to accommodate Ton's Orion kit. All that for later. Right now I'm applying colored lines around the bottom of the SRB.

[lee4752]

My first attempt at Stage 1 of came out about 3 inches too short. I found where the shrinkage came from. I'll leave it to the rest of you to come up with the proper rocket Viagra witticisms (ain't I generous?). The next try will be full size for 1/144 scale.

[APA-168]

Very nice. I am sorry tell you FYI that NASA's official drawings only show the logo/emblem/United States lettering on one side of the rocket. :) What parts are you using from Ton's model that you feel could be improved upon? I have just about finished an updated production version, but if there's more you feel could be improved upon let me know.

[lee4752]

I think the engine nozzle and fairing at the base of the SRB are more structurally sound and a little easier to build on Ton's kit. I'm also combining the odd arrow-shaped structures on the engine fairing from both of your kits. At the top of the SRB, I'm adding some detail of my own. Essentially, this is an overwrap of the "louvered" bit shown in the photo at the top of the SRB. I redrew the second stage to be able to accommodate a new fairing for Ton's latest Orion. While at it, I'm trying to incorporate some of the details in the photo that are different or missing from both kits. I'll send along my parts drawings to you when I feel they're close to right. I'm doing them in powerpoint because that's all I currently have and it would take me some time to learn a new drawing program, let alone afford the software. I know there's some freeware out there, but there's still the learning curve. The structures on Ares I are fairly simple, so powerpoint is good enough for now. These can be saved into other formats like jpeg and photoshopped if the need arises.

[lee4752]

Very nice. I am sorry tell you FYI that NASA's official drawings only show the logo/emblem/United States lettering on one side of the rocket. :)
I've only seen official drawings and photos of artist impressions of one side of the rocket. There simply doesn't seem to be anything to verify whether the logos and emblems are symmetrically applied. If my memory serves (a debatable assumption at best), previous rockets at least had the "UNITED STATES" lettering on both sides. If the logos, emblems, etc. are in fact only on one side, they can easily be removed from the model parts I drew.

[APA-168]

There is a drawing on one of the NASA websites of the Ares I-X which shows the logos on one side. I have it around somewhere, I'll see if I can post it.

I did add detail to the top of the second stage on the production version, as well as a bit to the SRB. I am staying true to the new drawings from 10/08 which are very different from earlier versions. Ton's model, though nice is inaccurate in regard to the second stage.

[lee4752]

I completely redrew the second stage and added detail from the reference photos on the web site you steered me to. Most of the datails are on the bottom of the second stage and interstage. I don't know the age of these drawings, however. I'd like to see your latest version

[APA-168]

This is the drawing I based my model off of. If you look, it shows the logo only on one side. I did add a lot of the detail seen on here to the updated production model. I'll send you the revised files this afternoon. :)

http://www.safesimplesoon.com/assets/images/Ares%20I-new%20drawings/ARES%20I%20EXTERNAL%202-HiRes.jpg

[lee4752]

It took me a while to recognize the one-sided logos and lettering even after you pointed it out. Still, I'm going to take some artistic license with my build and do this with the emblems on both sides. We won't actually know that I'm wrong until they actually produce one and unveil it to the public. Meanwhile, I've primarily been using the drawing in the middle of the bottom row on that same site for details. The first photo shows the first stage back to the correct size, with my first attempt included for reference. You can see the "arrow-shaped" structures on the engine nozzle fairing, which are a combination of Ton's and Avery's renditions. The second photo shows my attempt at texturing the top of the first stage with an overwrap of the louver-like detail. I still need to add the various stripes around the SRB and the instrumentation duct up the side. Then, I go to the fairing at the top of the SRB and the interstage with alltheir respective details.

[APA-168]

True, we won't know anything definitively until they build the darn thing, I'm just slightly OCD when it comes to research and I need definitive images before I do anything. :D

[lee4752]

I wasn't suggesting you change your kit regarding emblem placement (now that you've shown me the one drawing that has the emblems on one side only). The references are pretty poor at best. There are too many versions showing different details between them. Assuming you want to get your rocket model built now, you have to pick one and stay with it. Otherwise you end up going nuts. It only ought to take a day or two to build the basic kit, but you can easily spend a week adding details. If you tried to do every possible configuration I've seen drawings of, you could easily spend half a year on them, without any of them being the correct version. The rocket manufacturers are a little perverse about releasing disinformation. I don't know whether it's an effort to throw off their competition or, whether they really don't know what it will look like until they have one built for real.

[APA-168]

Agreed. I'm just trying to stick to one drawing but I did add some detail from some other photos to add "interest" and who knows, until we get a real rocket we can only guess. :rolleyes:

I'll try to get the files to you tomorrow, sorry I keep forgetting. :eek:

[lee4752]

Here's my progress on puttinh some details on the Ares I: I have the second stage complete minus a few fiddly little bits above the NASA Logo. I used Ton's engine and tank covers and his J-2 engine nozzle. I made a bunch of steering thruster details along with other bits shown on the reference drawing I used. The second stage is separable from the top of the interstage. The extra cylinder in one of the photos is internal structure for the shroud between the second stage and the Orion CSM. Orion will also be separable from the rocket. Now I just need to design the shroud and put it all together.

[lee4752]

OK, so it looks more like a tamale.:D I could tweak the upper shroud some more (it's a little tight fitting the Orion CSM). Also, it's about 1/16th inch too short. I had to pop-in the tank cover in the second stage to get Orion seated in the shroud. BTW, I made this shroud specifically to come close to fitting with Ton's latest Orion CSM.
Back from my days in USAF comm maintenance, the saying was, "If you can't fit it, force it!" That was one of the sayings, anyway. The rest should not be shown where small eyes can read 'em.
Anyway, the model will break down to the following parts:

SRB - first stage/shroud/interstage
Second stage/shroud
Orion Service Module
Orion Command Module
Launch Escape System
I'd show more pictures of the rocket in pieces, but the fit at the top is tight enough to make me not want to take it apart. Besides, you can see the individual pieces in my previous posts.

Avery, if you want them, I'll send you a set of JPEG files of my detail parts. Aside from the slight fit problem of the upper shroud everything else seemed to go about right.
I used the following parts from Ton's kit (scaled down to 67%):

SRB engine nozzle
SRB engine shroud
small arrow-shaped parts on the engine shroud (combined with Avery's parts at the same location)
1st - 2nd stage shroud (reverse side out - Avery's shroud would have worked here too, but I already had Ton's printed)
2nd stage engine nozzle, engine cover, & tank cover
Orion Command & Service Module
Launch Escape System
I traced over Avery's SRB main cylinder to get the "UNITED STATES" lettering on both sides. We already had that discussion. I replaced the upper part of his SRB (from the black line just above the lettering to the top) in order to fit the texturing detail. I redrew the second stage main cylinder. I also drew all the fiddly bit details other than the arrow shaped structures on the engine shroud already mentioned.