CT-114 Tutor (CL-41) Canadair - Snowbirds RCAF

[airdave]

[This will be another co-posted topic between papermodelforum.com and papermodelers.com.
So I will be copying some thread posts over between the two forums.]

I've decided to detour a little from planned projects...

and revisit a paper model idea from a few years back.
At the time, there didn't seem like much interest, and the variant options are limited...
so I shelved the idea in favour of other "retail" projects.

But I have some new reasons to bring this idea back onto my pile
and judging from comments on other forums, maybe enough interest to make this a worthwhile project.

I'm still going to be working on other projects, but a CT-114 model will be more of a priority for a while.

...
The Canadair CT-114 or Tutor is the Canadian jet trainer.
Its also the aircraft used by Canada's Snowbirds Aerobatic team.

http://aircraftrecognition.co.uk/images/Display%20teams/snowbirds/canadian-snowbirds-formation.jpg.500x400.jpg

The aging Tutor is now 50 years old.
And other than the Snowbirds dozen aircraft, all have been retired.
As far as I know, only one other Air Force in the world used Tutor...Malaysia.
They too, have switched to the BAE Hawk.

Anyway, I have way too many projects on the go all the time, so I don't mess around.
Nobi did such a fine job for me with the initial 3D design of the mustang D model,
so I have already commissioned him to do the base work on the Tutor.

My plan is a 1/33 scale model with full interior, as well as landing gear, wheel wells, air brakes, etc.

I love the look of the standard RCAF version...reminds me of Xplanes and test pilot aircraft.
So that, and a Snowbirds version are a definite must do.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4d/CFBMooseJaw01.JPG

Along with those, there is also:
1. Golden Centenairre - 1967 Centenary (Canada's Confederation)
2. Canadian Aerospace paint scheme (as shown on the Tutor Wikipedia page)
3. Red Knights Aerobatic team
4. RCAF 75th Anniversary paint scheme
5. NATO 50th Anniversary
6. CL41R experimental

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9d/Canadair_Tutor_Aerospace_Engineering_Test_Establis hment.jpg

As far as I know, the only other option is the Malaysian AF, which I believe is a fighter/trainer.
Known as the CL-41 Tebuan.
No guns...but payload mounted below the aircraft.
So, that should be interesting.

http://www.reocities.com/faisal4589/tebuan04.jpg

...
My next step is a test build of Nobi's base work...work out any kinks.
And then its on to detailing and expanding on basic components that Nobi has included as per my instructions.
Paint schemes are a ways off at the moment.

It will be fun to document the design stages (much like I did with the Centurion Tank and P51 Mustang)
so stay tuned!!

[airdave]

I just got the final files from Nobi...

starting on some clean up and arranging some pages for printing right now.

First thing is to run through a white build...make sure it all goes together the way I want.
Get Nobi to fix anything I don't like (that will be minimal I guaranty).
And then start laying out my first paint scheme (probably Snowbirds).

I also plan on adding more details to a few areas.
Nobi did a good job with basic Cockpit, Landing gear ,etc
but I will probably redesign those from scratch after I have seen the basic construction.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/CT-114%20original%20nobi.jpg

[airdave]

As I stated, the first thing I have to do is build what Nobi has designed for me.

Not only to test the assembly of the model, but also;
to make any necessary changes to the base model (before I start modifications),
to examine areas of the model that will receive modifications,
and to familiarize myself with the model itself.

Unfortunately, I cannot restrain myself...and I have already started making some changes as I work.
(If anything, it will help speed up the next stages)
So, I've already started to layout out my basic pages, rearrange model parts to fit, etc.
I've also made up the tabbed joiner strips I will need.

Just printed up the first three pages of parts...and away we go.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%201.jpg

[Knife]

As far as I know, there's no CT-114 models out there, in pla***c or paper. A shame because it is a good looking airplane. The Snowbirds are definitely one of the finest acrobatic teams in the world. I look forward to both your build in the release of the model. Thanks Nobi and Airdave.

[palindrome]

PLEASE do this version of the Snowbirds paint scheme in addition to or in place of the one in your picture:

http://www.rcaf-arc.forces.gc.ca/assets/AIRFORCE_Internet/images/news-nouvelles/2013/10/SnowbirdsYHM1306AndyCline-1998lo.jpg
I will DEFINITELY buy a Snowbirds model (or both if you do both)!

[airdave]

As far as I know, there's no CT-114 models out there, in pla***c or paper.


There are at least two 1/48 scale plastic kits from HobbyCraft (of the Tutor).
But I have seen at least four different box tops.
Maybe just updated artwork? Maybe different versions?

All Canadian liveries. (No Malaysian AF)
Hobbycraft is a Canadian company.

[MacSongLi]

This project really gets me excited Dave. There are a lot of different Snowbird liveries that could be done. The printed sheets look great, I sure hope that you'll be able to keep this thread updated with all of the juicy details.

Gary

[herky]

put me down for the snowbirds scheme also.i have a great photo in a book of the golden centennaires in 1967.thats a brilliant paint scheme

[airdave]

I do appreciate the enthusiasm,
but keep in mind, I'm a long way away from paint schemes yet!

FYI these are the aircraft I plan to publish:
1. Golden Centennaire - 1967 Centenary (Canada's Confederation)
2. Red Knights Aerobatic team
3. RCAF 75th Anniversary paint scheme
4. Snowbirds (modern)
5. RCAF standard Trainer
6. Malaysian AF CL-41G Tebuan
7. [under consideration] Canadian Aerospace paint scheme (as shown on the Tutor Wikipedia page)
8. [under consideration] NATO 50th Anniversary

[herky]

The 1967 gold scheme gets my vote but thars just personal preference.

[herky]

I do appreciate the enthusiasm,
but keep in mind, I'm a long way away from paint schemes yet!

FYI these are the aircraft I plan to publish:
1. Golden Centennaire - 1967 Centenary (Canada's Confederation)
2. Red Knights Aerobatic team
3. RCAF 75th Anniversary paint scheme
4. Snowbirds (modern)
5. RCAF standard Trainer
6. Malaysian AF CL-41G Tebuan
7. [under consideration] Canadian Aerospace paint scheme (as shown on the Tutor Wikipedia page)
8. [under consideration] NATO 50th Anniversary

this one please
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8iPIcwvs3w

[NOBI]

This model is quite big and have more than 100 parts to assemble. I just modified wing root as Dave's request and can be sent to him very soon...I'm sure that Dave's modification from my design will be a very great model and very fun to build.

[ashevilleangler]

Looks like a model that needs a nice clear vacu-formed canopy.

Curt

[airdave]

...continuing on, I have been test building a few parts.

I decide to start with the cockpit (since Nobi had numbered those parts first).

Right off the bat I see a few areas that I need to adjust and change.
This is not a criticism of Nobi's quality of design,
just some things that aren't the same as what I see in photos and some things I want to put my own ideas to.

I had already been working on a simple design for the ejection seats,
and I like my artwork over what Nobi has chosen to do.

Keep in mind, I originally just specified a "cockpit tub" with basic components.
So, I had originally planned to to do my own style of cockpit.

I built up Nobi's cockpit to familiarize myself...

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%203.jpg

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%202.jpg

and then I started swapping in my own parts
and adding some colour and textures.

For the first design, I've also included the Snowbird's red and blue seat cushions
(since the first kit will be a Snowbirds model).
Other versions will just have gray or green cushions.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%204.jpg

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%206.jpg

This is also the first aircraft model where I have not used a photographic instrument panel.
Its a lot of work, editing and creating a miniature photo panel...
and it usually doesn't print that great anyway.
So, I am trying a new, graphic approach.

Keep in mind, there is still some tweaking...
and I just got in contact with Nobi, because I have changed the fuselage.cockpit construction
and asked him to modify a few parts...which will force some cockpit alterations too!
So, what you see is still in early design stages.
But, I like it!

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%205.jpg

[herky]

...continuing on, I have been test building a few parts.

I decide to start with the cockpit (since Nobi had numbered those parts first).

Right off the bat I see a few areas that I need to adjust and change.
This is not a criticism of Nobi's quality of design,
just some things that aren't the same as what I see in photos and some things I want to put my own ideas to.

I had already been working on a simple design for the ejection seats,
and I like my artwork over what Nobi has chosen to do.

Keep in mind, I originally just specified a "cockpit tub" with basic components.
So, I had originally planned to to do my own style of cockpit.

I built up Nobi's cockpit to familiarize myself...

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%203.jpg

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%202.jpg

and then I started swapping in my own parts
and adding some colour and textures.

For the first design, I've also included the Snowbird's red and blue seat cushions
(since the first kit will be a Snowbirds model).
Other versions will just have gray or green cushions.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%204.jpg

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%206.jpg

This is also the first aircraft model where I have not used a photographic instrument panel.
Its a lot of work, editing and creating a miniature photo panel...
and it usually doesn't print that great anyway.
So, I am trying a new, graphic approach.

Keep in mind, there is still some tweaking...
and I just got in contact with Nobi, because I have changed the fuselage.cockpit construction
and asked him to modify a few parts...which will force some cockpit alterations too!
So, what you see is still in early design stages.
But, I like it!

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%205.jpg

nice work on the cockpit

[airdave]

Checking the assembly of the nose parts...all good.

Checking the fit of the Nose Wheel box. Good.
Needs a bit of enlargement...and some gluing tabs.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%206_1.jpg

Its, around the cockpit area, that I have a bit of fit problem.
And I don't like the lack of bulkhead formers in this area.
So I have altered the fuselage design a bit...Nobi is supplying me with some new formers,
and I am modifying how the cockpit fits into place.

Other than that, I am chuffed with how its coming together.

So, now I cut it up and build it again!
lol
Because I have a plan to eliminate those ugly seams on the underside.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20white%20test%207.jpg

[Richschindler]

Coming together very nicely. Can't wait to see the finished product. Better yet, can't wait to get one of my own!

[MacSongLi]

Very nice and meticulous work. I will be a beautiful model.

Gary

[airdave]

Look what I did today!

I completed all the artwork for the logos and insignias and graphics...
and laid out the paint scheme for the Snowbirds Tutor!

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/Untitled-1.jpg

But don't get too excited.
I'm still stuck on test building the fuselage.
And Nobi is working on a few extras for me...incluidng modifying the engine and wing attachments.
(I was unhappy with the shape of some parts, so we have redesigned things a bit).

I think I have got the fuselage sorted out...and I am now building the tail section.
(I'll post some pics soon)
I am on my fourth build of the fuselage/cockpit...I just couldn't get a handle on Nobi's original design.
So, I made my own modifications which didn't completely work.
After some more changes, I think I finally have an assembly I like.
Once I confirm that the full length of the fuselage goes together properly, I'll post a report.

Tonight...test fit the new Exhaust insert parts.
I've added an inner wall to the fuselage end, and a separate jet exhaust tube to go inside that.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/exhaust%20inserts.jpg

[MacSongLi]

Absolutely beautiful work Dave. Very impressive.

Gary

[airdave]

Short bump - quick update

Been doing little bits here and there...I've built four cockpits so far.
Three Nose assemblies...working on the fourth.
And two rear fuselage halves.

All this because I am modifying the design at the same time as I introduce new details and parts.
I'm also running into small problems in a couple of areas...
one being the engine, and wing root design.
With Nobi's help, we have sorted out some changes and he is updating the basic template.

I also just started a test build of the Snowbird's artwork...

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2568.jpg

and introduced some new exhaust parts for the tail end of the plane.
Which have worked out quite nicely.
(Nobi is also designing for me, the rear fairing and smoke/diesel injector nozzles)

While assembling the Snowbirds fuselage, I got to try out my updated Speedbrake recesses and door assemblies.
Unfortunately, this brought to light another design problem with the model.
...and some related assembly problems have now led to me redesign the rear fuselage

and once again, Nobi is modifying the template to my instructions.
(lol Poor guy!)

Anyway, I am slowing down with test builds until I get the new template,
and then I'll probably start again with another Snowbird's test.

Stay tuned bat-fans!

[herky]

looking good so far

[herky]

found a photo on facebook i thought you might like:)

[airdave]

yup, good photo.

...
I'm waiting on Nobi to send me some updated files.
Not doing much at the moment with the model.
In fact, I haven't been doing much all week since my father went into the hospital again.
He passed away this morning...so things are a bit somber at the moment.
(Please, thats not a request for sympathy messages...its actually a relief to end the five year battle with alzheimers.
I just have to help my Mom get through this.)

...
Sitting on a new set of speed brake doors for the tail of the Tutor
can't wait until the new tail artwork gets here so I can try them out!
That was one of the major reasons for having to redesign the tail section.
A fuselage seam was just too close to the speed brake doors, making the part very weak and difficult to assemble.

[hercru9]

Deepest Condolences Dave

Here's a pic of a Snowbird with a Red Arrow, Thunderbird and a Blue Angels over Quebec City for its 400th Anniversary. Too cool.

Looking forward to your release of the Tutor. Worked on them many, many, moons ago in Moose Jaw, SK.

Take care,
Don

[herky]

Deepest Condolences Dave

Here's a pic of a Snowbird with a Red Arrow, Thunderbird and a Blue Angels over Quebec City for its 400th Anniversary. Too cool.

Looking forward to your release of the Tutor. Worked on them many, many, moons ago in Moose Jaw, SK.

Take care,
Don

now that would make a great display model;)

[kingjason14]

I'm sorry for your loss Dave. You and your family will be in my prayers.

I don't know how I missed the start of this thread. This is very cool! There is a flying CT-114 on the field where I work, it is hangered right behind my building.

[Paper Kosmonaut]

Sorry to hear that, Dave. My condolences. And I wish you and your family / next of kin lots of strength. I totally understand the relief factor, by the way.

[chicharrero]

I'm sorry, Dave

[airdave]

There is a flying CT-114 on the field where I work, it is hangered right behind my building.

Don't be afraid to take some photos for me?

To be honest, I have internet access to a couple of good "walkarounds"
and many more photos.
And there is a Tutor in my local Air Museum that I will go see (and take some photos)
But you never know what might come up in the futuure.
Do you have access for detail photos?

...
No model work today...got to arrange a Cremation.
And then take my Mom for a walk or whatever.

[MacSongLi]

Dave,

So to hear about your father. My deepest sympathies to you and your family.
Great work on the CT-114. Very impressive.

Gary

[kingjason14]

Don't be afraid to take some photos for me?

To be honest, I have internet access to a couple of good "walkarounds"
and many more photos.
And there is a Tutor in my local Air Museum that I will go see (and take some photos)
But you never know what might come up in the futuure.
Do you have access for detail photos?

...
No model work today...got to arrange a Cremation.
And then take my Mom for a walk or whatever.

I'll keep my eyes open. I have never spoken to the owner, but if they start 'er up, I can't miss it, so I will try to get so pictures, what specifically do you want photographed?

[airdave]

Nothing yet. lol
Just wanted to know if there was a source for photos if I needed it.

Thanks Gary.
I'd much rather go to the Museum than deal with this cremation crap.

[kingjason14]

I just searched the FAA site, there is one CT-114 registered in the US of A,
FAA Registry - Aircraft - N-Number Inquiry (http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/NNum_Results.aspx?NNumbertxt=4017B)

[Isaac]

Pictures I took last month at the Ottawa aviation museum.


This one is hanging inverted at the lobby.

251986251987251988251989


There is also one in Toronto's Downsview airport where the museum used to be. Also next to it is an S-2 tracker. It is now inside the gate of the Bombardier facility.
https://www.google.ca/maps/place/Downsview+Airport/@43.7370138,-79.4684075,54m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x882b321f3edff563:0x80d0c 0010153c8e9?hl=en


My first encounter with the Snow birds was in 1980 when I flew a C-152 to Quonset point station in Rhode Island ( USA ) for an airshow. I had to yield to to one cutting into the downwind pattern. It was fun to watch them perform ! Very graceful when compared to the Thunderbirds or Blue angles.



Isaac

[GWC]

I am so totally ready to buy a version of the snowbirds! Extremely well done gentlemen!

[airdave]

This is the second time I have hired Nobi to do the basic 3D design work of a model
and once again I am very satisfied with what he has provided me.
As well as fixing a few problem areas, he's also had to put up with my alterations.

I am thrilled to give Nobi the work,
and to be honest, it frees me up to do seventeen other projects while I am waiting.
Thanks Nobi!

So, now, I am just waiting on, what I hope will be, the final template for the Tutor
and then I can start making my final modifications and such.

I have already designed the cockpit, new air brake pots and doors,
and laid out the Snowbirds paint scheme.
(Unfortunately I have to redo the paint scheme since I modified the tail fuselage sections...but it shouldn't be too much problem).

I ordered wing pylons...to receive fuel tanks on the RCAF version
and center pylons to receive the smoke/diesel canisters on the Snowbirds version.
I've designed plenty of wing pylons and tanks myself,
but since Nobi hadn't finished the basic work yet, I asked him to do them. (...lazy)

oh...I still have to design the new Landing Gear for the plane,
but that should be it.

And...a full test build again.

Shouldn't be long now!

[airdave]

okay, so its been a while since I updated...

heres what has happened with the CT-114 Tutor model (and the Snowbirds prototype):

the first modifications I made, were to the wing root design.
I wanted a larger root fairing, more taper at the back, etc
and this also meant redesigning the engine intakes and how they fit to the wing roots.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct-114%20multi.jpg

So I passed along all this re-design work to Nobi, who sorted it out in short time.

In the meantime, Nobi had also designed the wing mounts and long range fuel tanks that I had requested.
At the same time he was able to create the center mounted tanks* for the Snowbirds planes as per my instructions.
(*Diesel fuel for aerobatic smoke)

It was during this time that I went ahead and assembled a Fuselage...in Snowbirds livery.

I found a number of small fixes...but I ran into a big problem with the rear half of the fuselage.
Assembly was difficult partly based on the model design.
(One section just too long to reach inside, making control of the assembly quite difficult
...and the area around the speed brake openings was just too narrow, making the fuselage very weak in one area.)

So, I designed a new layout, new part configuration, moved some seams...and passed along the idea to Nobi,
who redesigned everything to my satisfaction.

I redid the Snowbirds paint work...altered the exhaust parts to fit the new fuselage sections...
and did a full test build of the fuselage.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/snowbird%20fuselage%2001.jpg

I also made some adjustments to the instrument panel, cowling and canopy parts.
Combined with the entirely redesigned Cockpit, it all seems to go together quite well.

Heres a couple more shots with the canopy removed.
Obviously I have not fixed the canopy on the model.
A paper canopy needs to mounted in the open position, or left unattached (to view the cockpit if installed).
For the next build, I'll try a clear canopy (fixed in place).

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/snowbird%20fuselage%2003.jpg

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/snowbird%20fuselage%2002.jpg

[Mike1158]

Looking really nice.

[airdave]

Even added the exhaust nozzles for the aerobatic smoke.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/exhaust%20nozzles.jpg

[zot]

Nice touch!

[kingjason14]

That is looking real good!

[elliott]

The fuselage and cockpit look particularly good Dave, as do the exhaust nozzles. Should be a real looker once a complete model is assembled.

[14thWarrior]

My brain just melted while looking at the amazing detail and hard work you're putting into this model Dave.

I searched for a CT-114 model for years. Unable to find one, a few years ago, I started work on one of my own. However, my proficiency at 3D modelling is pathetic, at best; so I soon gave up on it. Then, I found this thread and found out you were working on one; and I could not be happier about it.

I am waiting patiently for you to publish this model and make it available for sale; you've got a guaranteed sale right here. :D In the meantime, I read your updates with excitement and interest.

Great work on the model!

[airdave]

well howdy doo...and thank yu too!

nice to hear there are so many people looking forward to this one.
I hope it turns out well.

Like with many subjects I have modeled, I start out with little interest in the subject
and by the end of the project, I am in it up to my ears!
I am looking forward to completing this one.

[MacSongLi]

Very nice work (as usual, and now as expected) Dave. I love the added details of the smoke nozzles.

Gary

[GWC]

I hate to ask, no not really. This is a marvellous kit, as an armour guy I definitely want to purchase one of these kits! Reminds me of the many many times I watched those pilots in action. When can we expect to see this kit ready to purchase!?

[airdave]

Your guess is as good as mine.
This year?
Probably not...
but then again,
nope, probably not,
but you never know...
and neither do I.
Soon?
or later?
okay then.

[NOBI]

I just come back from vacation and will modified model as Dave request. I will send him a revise version soon, very very soon :-P

[herky]

Your guess is as good as mine.
This year?
Probably not...
but then again,
nope, probably not,
but you never know...
and neither do I.
Soon?
or later?
okay then.

sooooooo thats a definate mayby??:)

[GWC]

It is like Christmas! The anticipation! Thanks airdave and NOBI, great collaboration��

[airdave]

sooooooo thats a definate mayby??:)

...possibly.

[Texman]

...possibly.

Could be..

[airdave]

okay, so I haven't worked on the Tutor in some time...
was working with Nobi to make a few changes to the design.
Nobi has now finished the commisoned work for me,
and so its all up to me now.

Unfortunately life has dealt a new set of cards this year
and I have been busy with personal and home issues.
So, the paper model work has taken a backseat.

Until today.

Nothing else to do today, other than try to watch a Nascar race online...
so I decided to open up the files (on the computer)
and finalize the redesigned wing ribs/spars and landing gear boxes.
I test printed some parts and it looks like I have only a couple of minor adjustments to make.

Yes, there are a whole bunch of corner braces (which I have not fitted yet)
which will strenghten and square up the spar/rib assembly.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/tutor%20proto%20build%2028.jpg

So, maybe the Tutor is back on the workbench.
woohoo
I still need to do the Snowbird art/paint on the wing parts before I can test build the wings themselves.

[herky]

its looking good so far.glad to see youre back on it

[nikischutt]

Beautiful aircraft, looking forward to it.

[airdave]

Well, I have been continuing with the Snowbird build...this is a good thing right?
Maybe I can get back into it and get the model done before Xmas?!

I wanted to show this excellent example of how I deal with changes to the design work.
With a project like this, I know from the start that I will be modifying the basic design,
swapping in my own parts, adding stuff, and tossing out some of the original work that I don't like.

Luckily, when commissioning Nobi to do work, you won't find much you don't like.

But not everything works right, and theres always a lot of changes and adjustments to suit my preferences.
And, since I didn't design the basics, I have to figure out the design and assembly (as Nobi intended).

I'm working on the vertical Tail (Rudder) which also supports the raised Elevators.
Nobi provided an assembly diagram...
but the small, perspective view didn't make things completely clear.
There are four parts...straightforward...with cross join slots...and one gusset style brace part.

But, once assembled, the parts don't match the Tail shape...and are too big, too long.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20tail%2001.jpg

...
After some thinking, I realized that the angles in the assembly drawing are actual "angles".
The parts need to be angled during assembly.
(More like whats in the next photo)
But this presents more problems.
The 1mm thick parts don't angle within 1mm wide slots.
The upright support actually bent while trying to form the parts.
And everything is still too long and doesn't line up properly.

As a 2D drawing...minus the 1mm thickness...it looks like it should work.
But it doesn't.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20tail%2002.jpg

...
So, I started from scratch...using the overall shape and size of the Tail fin part...
and readjusted the lengths of the upper and lower forms.

I kept an upright part...just resized...and moved rearward, so it can maintain a right angle connection.
(This is the only slotted connection now)

And to hold everything in place, three simple gusset pieces.
(Just position, center, and glue in place)

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20tail%2003.jpg

...
The mounting locator hole idea is retained (in the fuselage)
but it has to be repositioned because of the modified vertical support position.

The small lower gusset part is optional, but it helps with the mounting to the fuselage.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20tail%2004.jpg

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20tail%2005.jpg

...
You can fit the structure to the fuselage, but I found it better to glue the structure inside the Tail fin first.
Then mount the entire assembly on to the fuselage.

But I guess the builder will find their own preferred method.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/ct114%20tail%2006.jpg

...
Next step is the horizontal Elevator which mounts at the top of the vertical Tail fin.
You can see the spar already in place.
Hopefully the attachment of the two elevators is without issues.
Stay tuned.

[Bluenoser]

Oooh, this looks nice!

[14thWarrior]

Fantastic post Dave!

The very detailed design and build process explanation and photos provides so much insight; not only about the hard work you put in on designing your models, but in how to I can improve my own modelling skills.

Thanks for posting so much detail about your process.

[MacSongLi]

Dave,

I love you design updates. So much goes into the design that builders don't get to see. Great work.

Gary

[airdave]

A couple more days, and a little more effort...
and I feel like I am getting back into the swing of things with this Tutor model!

I decided to continue with the Main Wings before anything else
and it turned out to be a little more work than expected.
Another example of how the design works, but it doesn't go together exactly as I want,
so a few adjustments have to be made.

The wing design is two parts (not including the wing tip pieces).

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/wing%20parts.jpg

Similar to the P51 Mustang, these wings have an angled extension at the inboard root area.
(This is also the jet intake area...the intake parts will mount on top of the wing)

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/wing%20parts%202.jpg

To create this in paper, requires splitting the wing into two parts and joining them together
after the front edge has been rolled/folded.
My first problem is getting a tight fit at the center of the leading edge.
The shape of the two parts just doesn't match.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2923.jpg

So, I did some trimming, drew up a new part... did it twice....and eventually got a better fit.
But it takes a fair bit of careful gluing and patience.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2924.jpg

But now my problem is with the seam that wraps around the wing.
(Here are two different test wings...I wanted to test the new part design twice.)
I just don't like that big seam running right around the wing like this.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2925.jpg

And then I remembered the P51 design.
It has a similarly shaped wing.
And the paper model has two parts for each wing...but that angled area of the wing, is a smaller part.
(The basic p51 design is also a Nobi commission!)
So, why didn't Nobi use the same design for this Tutor Jet wing?
Probably didn't think of it, thats all.

So, I assembled all the parts (in Coreldraw) and created a one piece complete wing,
and then broke it into two parts again...but this time, one large wing part and a smaller part just for that extension area.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2926.jpg

I had to try two test builds, and after a few tweaks, I got it to fit nicely.
And now there is no seam running through the wheel well openings!
If you are building wheels down, open wheel wells, that seam might have caused a big problem.
Not to mention trying to line up all the panel lines and flaps (across that seam).

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2927.jpg

But best of all...no ugly visible seam across the top of the wings.
The most visible area of the model (I think) is now clean and smooth.

So now, I can make up some Snowbird (red and white) wings and fit them to the model.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2929.jpg

[Vermin_King]

Outstanding! I could never have worked that out

[14thWarrior]

That is some mind blowing attention to detail!

[chicharrero]

Wow,friends, this model promises...;)
The level of detail is incredible:eek:

[MacSongLi]

Unbelievable work Dave. You are the master.

Gary

[herky]

its all been said so i will just wait for the model

[airdave]

Thanks guys.

...
Still workin...printed out some Wing parts today (for the Snowbird test build).
Hopefully the rain delayed Nascar race will run today, and I'll work on the model while I am watching!
As I mentioned before, this first test build will be a wheels-up build.
I actually don't have the final landing gear designed anyway.

This made me realize I will need a display stand for the Snowbird model
and so I started to think about a pedestal type stand that I will include in the Tutor kits.

And that, prompted thoughts about the Snowbirds paint scheme.
Which team member do I add to the tail of the jet? And which serial number do I put on the plane?

First thing I did was research the Snowbird planes by hunting for photos of the aircraft where I can see the tail number and the serial number.
But I'm only looking at the most recent paint scheme design, since there have been a few variations over the decades.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/snowbird%20line%20up.jpg

And using found photos, I was able to put together a list of known Tail No./Serial No. combinations for all the planes.

*Looks like the Snowbirds have 12 planes at the ready, numbered 1 through 12.
But I believe only 9 fly at one time.
I guess three extra planes are backup in case of mechanical issues at an event?
Keep in mind, these are the only flying Tutors left in existence.
All other CL41s were retired decades ago, when they should have been!
This is a 55 year old aircraft!

Anyway...I realized that it would be hard to pick only one team number to put on the model
and there will undoubtedly be requests for other Tail numbers.
There might even be someone who wants to build a formation of nine aircraft!

So, I have added a complete set of Tails to the kit.
And alternate fuselage parts with the various serial numbers that go with each tail.
The main model will be aircraft number 1 (serial no. 114006)
with two extra pages added to this kit with the alternate parts.
This is just for the Snowbirds version of the model.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/snowbird%20options.jpg

[kingjason14]

And using found photos, I was able to put together a list of known Tail No./Serial No. combinations for all the planes.

*Looks like the Snowbirds have 12 planes at the ready, numbered 1 through 12.
But I believe only 9 fly at one time.
I guess three extra planes are backup in case of mechanical issues at an event?
Keep in mind, these are the only flying Tutors left in existence.
All other CL41s were retired decades ago, when they should have been!
This is a 55 year old aircraft!


Except this one:
FAA Registry - Aircraft - N-Number Inquiry (http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/NNum_Results.aspx?NNumbertxt=4017B)

[airdave]

well, I wasn't including the handful of privately owned Tutors.

I watched two auctions recently for airworthy Tutors.
One had an asking price of $35,000...although it didn't have an engine.

[airdave]

So, I hit a bit of a setback on Sunday... had to throw out the wings.

I assembled two wing (skins) ready to slip over the inner wing support
but I kept damaging the outermost (tiny) rib part.
Its a tight fit, and the rib lines up right at the edge of the wingtip,
(where the tabbed gluestrip for the wingtip is located.)

Then I noticed that the wing skin was not sliding on deep enough to meet at the underside of the fuselage.
It wasn't covering the alignment marks (or the main spar holes in the belly).

After a while, I realized that the top side of the wing was hitting the side of the fuselage too early,
not allowing the wing to go on any further.
So I started trimming...
eventually getting the wing skin located far enough inboard.

But this had moved the position of the Landing gear doors too far inwards
and now they didn't line up with the wheel well boxes!

Anyway...to make a long story shorter...I threw out the old wing skin parts, redrawing them,
adding the necessary length to the belly side, slightly shortening the upper side,
and making a few minor adjustments to the Spar and Rib assembly.

New skins seem to slide on much easier and line up...a touch looser on the internal ribs,
but I think thats acceptable (gives you some tolerance to move the skins a bit, and line up the wheel well boxes).

Fingers crossed...I am about to glue these wings into place...

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/tutor%20wings%20attached.jpg

Oh yes...I also threw out all the Tail parts and created new ones!
LOL

The vertical was okay, but the attachment of the two horizontals was delicate and I didn't like it.
I also didn't like the shape of the upper extension (above the horizontal tailwings).

My new design has a one piece horizontal wing...and I cut the top off the vertical to receive it.
Then, you just add a small extension part to the top.

The new Tail is still a bit delicate. The two elements (vertical and horizontal) are thin and have a very
small connecting area. Even at this scale, its a delicate part. I don't want to over complicate the design.
So, as long as you use some good glue, and take your time with the assembly, it'll work.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/tutor%20tail%20wings%20attached.jpg

[gotham]

Very interesting to see the design prosess and the amount of work (and frustration) that actually goes into designing a model.
Anyone who pirate peoples work should look here and see what they are ripping off.

[Don Boose]

This has been almost as much fun as watching you perfect the treads for the Centurion tank model.

It is surely going to be a magnificent model!

I look forward to watching the saga continue. Ad astra per ardua.

Don

[Pgtaylorart]

Very interesting to see the design prosess and the amount of work (and frustration) that actually goes into designing a model.
Anyone who pirate peoples work should look here and see what they are ripping off.

Unfortunately, those pirates don't care what they are ripping off. I'm sure they are aware of the fact that there is a lot of work involved and they are incapable of creating this kind of work. These people have no conscience.

[airdave]

well, if you're gonna steal something
you may as well steal something worth stealing!

I guess I will feel slightly honored when someone decides to pirate one of my kits.

[airdave]

More work...slowly...and more modifications.

The wing assembly...fitting to the fuselage...root fairings...and engine intake housings
are proving to be a challenge.

Once again, not everything fits together easily...I think the biggest issue is the thickness of cardstock.
Curvy things don't curve that easily. Fit tolerances are thrown out of whack.

But I am making changes and adjustments to suit my tastes and a simpler assembly.
(Nobi has been informed...because I wanted to make sure he knows that I have no problem with his design work.
Sometimes, what looks good in the design stage, doesn't go together perfectly in the real world)

Anyway, I made an earlier suggestion to Nobi to extend the back end of the wing roots, to create
that little curved extension where it joins to the fuselage, and to create the concave wing root fairing.

Nobi created a two piece part that is very easy to assemble and shape...but it fights back when you try
to install it on to the wing root! I just could not install the part cleanly, and there is a conflicting compound
shape which resulted in a crease and a wrinkle.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2946.jpg

After some experimenting ....and studying of Tutor photos...I realized that I could get away with a straight angle part
at the root of the wing, instead of the curving edge.
I also didn't need a two-piece fairing because it disappears under the engine housing.

So, I've created a new part that appears to work...but I'll have to wait for the next test build to try it out.
(I can't remove the parts from this build at this point.)


I was also able to make a few adjustments to the fit of the underside intake housing, including how the white Snowbirds
paint scheme lines up. (You can still still the missing section on the fuselage...this has already been adjusted in the kit.)

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2947.jpg

Getting closer to the end now!
But it looks like I will have to build another test to check out all the modifications.
I also have to do a Landing gear build.
Maybe I'll do another paint scheme just for variation.
Maybe I can find someone to do another Snowbirds test build at the same time?

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2948.jpg

[cmdr199212]

Wow. That is a really clean build, and the colors look great on there! Good stuff.

[MacSongLi]

Great work Dave. The air intake looks pretty difficult (it looks like the install goes after the wing root). The colour alignment is fantastic.

Gary

[Don Boose]

It's really magnificent.

Don

[Loui]

a solid 5stars design... i like the open airbrake option.

[airdave]

yes, the open speedbrake compartment is an option.
You can choose to cut out the doors when assembling the fuselage.

I forgot to curve the door parts when building this model, so my doors are incorrectly flat.
While assembling the three parts that make up the door, you need to gently shape
the door "skins" to match the shape of the fuselage.

The inner rams that hold the doors open are a bit oversize.
This is just to make them a little easier to build.
A pro could probably find a way to shrink them down.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/speed%20brake%20detail.jpg

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/speedbrake%20doors%20detail%202.jpg

[airdave]

... The air intake looks pretty difficult (it looks like the install goes after the wing root).
Gary

This comment bothered me.
lol
Sometimes a part looks very complicated...and might scare some people away from building a model...
but in this case, its actually a pretty easy part to deal with
if you take your time and follow some basic construction methods.

I think this is a good part to illustrate some technique that can be applied to any and all construction.

I will be doing a full build report on the next test build,
and compiling a set of how-to photos for the tutor jet.
And I will probably repurpose and include the following instruct set.

.............................
Building the Jet Engine intake housing - part of the wing root/fuselage.
Step 1

Cut out the parts...in this case each side of the plane has an intake assembly
consisting of 8 parts, plus tabbed joiner strips, plus an internal part
plus the forward fairing/deflector.

This is where the first crucial step comes into play...precurve the parts.
gently form each section into the approximate shape of the final assembly.
(You can do the same with the tabbed joiner strips!)

You don't want to be shaping a part while you are trying to glue it to another.
Preshaping parts removes a lot of the effort when fitting parts together.
Allows you to concentrate more on glue and seams.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%201.jpg

...
Step 2
Now attach all the tabbed strips to the individual parts.
After handling each part...after gluing the strips...keep checking to make sure
they still retain the approximate curved shapes necessary.
Important step: Keep tweaking the parts back into shape.

I use round tools, like wooden dowels, and my fingers, to curve the parts.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%202.jpg

...
Step 3.
Important step: wait for glue to dry.
Be patient. Give parts time to setup, and glue to dry.
If not, when you work on adding more parts, you may disturb the previous connections.
I will often wait hours between small parts like this, just to make sure my conections are solid.

Now start attaching the curved sections one by one.
I started with the center part since it has tabbed strips pointing in both directions.
I also use some flat, smooth jaw, wide tweezers to make sure the glued areas
are securely postioned. Pressure actually helps speed up the glue process.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%203.jpg

...
Step 4.
The design allows you to attach three parts in both directions from that center part
and still wait for your glued connections to dry.

Take your time to make sure you have good tight connections between parts.
If you are using papercraft glues, you will have some time to shift and tighten those seams as best as possible.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%204.jpg

[airdave]

.............................
Continued - Building the Jet Engine intake housing - part of the wing root/fuselage.

Step 5
Important step: Pre-adjust the glue tabs to the correct angles.
The purpose behind "tabbed" glue strips is to deal with angled connections and curves.
The tabs can bend to suit the shape of the attaching part
....but once again, its easier to pre-bend the tabs to the approximate position
before you glue the next part in place.

Keep attaching sections, one at a time, to the assembly.
Be patient between parts to allow glue to dry.
Keep going until all parts are included.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%205.jpg

...
Step 6
I like to burnish seams once the entire assembly has been completed
and sufficient time has been allowed for the glue to completely dry.

Put the seam face down, on a clean section of the cutting surface,
and then using a hard rounded end object you can apply pressure to the inside of each seam.
Roll it along and across the seam strips and smooth out the outer surface.

I also apply extra glue over the tabbed strips, mainly near the edges of the assembly.
This will strengthen the edges of the paper so I can sand and trim the connections.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%206.jpg


...
Step 7
Install the former...
This part is mostly for visual purpose. Blocks your view into the wing/housing.
But it also heps shape the engine intake.

I glued the paper part to three more layer, making it about 1mm thick and much stiffer.
Then I sanded and shaped the part...test fitted it...and then glued it into place.
Important step: test fit...dry fit...sand, shape, trim (as necessary)...then test fit some more!
Until you are sure it fits properly and you understand exactly HOW it fits.
Then start applying glue.

PLUS...There is an optional part, since its a bit tricky to install.
This part lines the inside of the air inlet as it is on the real aircraft.

You only need to glue the leading edge of the part...it must stay flush with the edge.
Once again, it is necessary to pre-shape the part before you try to glue it into place.
Its hard enough aligning the edge and avoiding a glue mess,
you don't need to be struggling with the shape aswell!

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%207.jpg

[airdave]

.............................
Continued - Building the Jet Engine intake housing - part of the wing root/fuselage.

Final steps

Important step: test fit, test fit, test fit.
Test fit the part to the fuselage.
See how it fits and where it doesn't.

No matter how well you assembled the housing, the edges will be a little rough,
a little bit out of alignment.


Its very easy to sand the edges and clean them up.
You can also use scissors and a knife, to trim the edges.
Just be careful...you don't want to remove too much material or you will change the overall size of the part.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%208.jpg

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%209.jpg

...
Important step: test fit, test fit, test fit.
and, when you are satisifed with how well the assembly fits to the fuselage
its time to plan a gluing strategy.

A part like this has to slip into place...sliding back along the wing...
and then slde in another direction into the fuselage.
If you apply glue to edges and then try to position the part, you will leave glue trails
all over the place!
Plan where you can apply glue safely, and where you will have to glue after the part is installed.
Some areas can be lifted after installation, and glue carefully applied with toothpicks or fine brushes.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/engine%20intake%20assembly%2010.jpg


FYI
Assembly of each side housing (as you see in the last ten photos) took 3-4 days.
I waited many minutes and hours between part gluing.
I worked on the assembly for only a few hours (maybe 3?) spread over multiple days.
I still haven't glued the second housing into place yet.

I have learned, this is the only way to achieve the best looking assemblies.
Sometimes I am impatient and rush to finish a job, but those jobs are never going to win me any awards.

[MacSongLi]

FANTASTIC! Thanks for the detailed instructions. The final product is magnificent.

Gary

[elliott]

Another great, informative, lead-by-example build thread. An excellent model too with some of the best-looking colors I've seen yet.

[herky]

this has got to be one of the most detailed build threads ive seen.good onya dave

[hillsden]

Thanks for the practicum, Dave. Looking forward to this one

[airdave]

I'm struggling to make a mold for a vacuform canopy...
but other than that, I am at the end of this test build.

I am putting on the last few items, like little bracketry on the wing flaps.
And the underside pylons and diesel tanks.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2996.jpg

Since this is a Snowbirds aircraft, it would have two diesel fuel tanks underneath for the smoke generators.

I think all the exhibition aircraft carry these, but some display aircraft don't.
So, I guess its an optional thing for the builder.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/SAM_2997.jpg

Next step is some sort of "display stand" (since this model is wheels up) that I can include in the kit.
And then another full test build...wheels down...of another Tutor jet (different paint scheme of course).

[MacSongLi]

Dave,

The build looks great, I understand the struggle for a canopy, it would be a lot easier if those pesky aeronautical engineers would just design all canopies the shape of cubes!

Have you thought about sending some photos and perhaps a completed build to the Snowbirds in Moose Jaw?

Gary

[palindrome]

Any chance you'll sell canopies? I want to build a Snowbirds Tutor. My canopy-making skills are about nil...

[airdave]

well, thats kind of what I was thinking...
make a mold, make some canopies, and offer them for sale.

but first I priced the plastic sheets at Staples...$90 for 50 sheets?

and then I failed at the first mold attempt.
Then the second went as bad as the first.

So, now I am unsure if I can do this.

[palindrome]

I'm betting that Staples is about the most expensive place you could pick to buy stuff...

[airdave]

lol probably.

[airdave]

As I mentioned before, my next step is to rebuild the entire model
and document the entire build.
Hopefully all my modifcations will stick and I can complete the kit.

I still need to do Instruction pages and diagrams, so thats a fair bit of work.
It will be a challenge to have a kit ready before Xmas.

I've already started the paintwork on the second version of this kit.
And that will be my test build (rather than doing another Snowbirds model).

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/golden%20tutor.jpg

If someone would like to do a Snowbirds test build at the same time
I will pass along a kit.

But please don't offer to do it unless you can start right away and finish within a few weeks.
I will be relying on you for a build report so I can finalize this model.
(You don't have to do a public/forum build report...just report to me with photos)

This is a medium to advanced skill level kit, so I need someone with some skills.
I also need good photography, because I will be using your photos of the completed model.

if you are interested, just email me.
If I don't already know your work, please send me some pics.

...
Still struggling with this formed canopy.
I am reluctant to glue the paper one in place (on the Snowbird model) yet,
until I see if I can make a clear one.
I've got another Sculpy attempt to try today...just got to bake it.
But my problem with Sculpy is the smoothing putty won't stick to it.
So, I can't repair surface issues.

[airdave]

Well, I finally got a canopy made that I can use...but not without a fight!

I managed to make a form from Sculpy...my third.
And then I botched two vacuform attempts.

Using very thin plastic, I got a passable canopy.
Not good enough to sell...but after the paper frame was attached, it didn't look too bad.
Main thing is, it has the correct shape, so it fits.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/PA279630.jpg

And that means I can finish up this build.
Fit the canopy...and the bracket things in front of the canopy.

Also sorted out a display stand, which I will include in the final kits (decorated to each model).

Full set of HQ photos (of this model) here:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/65936213@N08/albums/72157660391251542

Now I will focus on the Golden Centennaires version
and start work on the Instruction pages.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/PA279637.jpg

[Vermin_King]

That looks very good, sir. I don't know enough about vacuforming. Why would thinner material make it not suitable for being done commercially? Problems in shipping?

[airdave]

That looks very good, sir. I don't know enough about vacuforming. Why would thinner material make it not suitable for being done commercially? Problems in shipping?

Thats not exactly what I meant.

I couldn't get the heavier plastic to form.
Either I couldn't heat it evenly, and/or the vacuum wasn't strong enough.

This thinner plastic is very soft and flexible.
Its got some minor ripples and wrinkles in it.
It might not stand up to shipping
and it doesn't look as good as vacuforms canopies that I have purchased in the past.

So, I wouldn't wouldn't feel comfortable selling them like this.
I would have to make something stronger and without imperfections.

[airdave]

I know we haven't finished the October fundraising for Hugo
but...I need a few bucks right away.
Can you help me out?

I wanna buy this (http://www.ebay.ca/itm/CT-114-Tutor-Jet-/281814303537?hash=item419d710331:g:bvoAAOxy4t1SemR 4&vxp=mtr)




...
(http://www.ebay.ca/itm/CT-114-Tutor-Jet-/281814303537?hash=item419d710331:g:bvoAAOxy4t1SemR 4&vxp=mtr)

[ashevilleangler]

Dave,

So just build 10,000 canopies and sell them for $3.50 apiece. BTW, your canopy looks just great to me. I wasn't able to do nearly that well with the same equipment.

Curt

[willygoat]

$35k is pretty damn cheap for that! Let me get my check book... oh, wait. Nope. I had to ask permission to buy ink last month. Sorry Dave. ;)

The Tutor is coming along great BTW!

[airdave]

I would love to go take some photos, but its a good four hours away (maybe more) by highway.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/tutor%20price.jpg


With the current exchange, I need $46k Canadian! lol
And then I need to buy an engine.

But, as it turns out, I already have a jet engine mechanic with experience on the Snowbirds aircraft.
Shes not in the RCAF anymore, but I'm sure she will help me install the spark plug.

[MacSongLi]

Dave, do you have a parking spot for the Tutor, or were you going to put it into a container (like all the rest of the Canadian Aviation Musuem pieces)?

Gary

[airdave]

My front yard is big enough.
It'll make a fine lawn ornament.
I can put lights on it (at Xmas).

[MacSongLi]

The neighbours will love you when you fire it up.

Gary

[Cami]

The canopy looks great, the plane looks great and it will look even better in a golden paint scheme, another beauty beauty Dave!

Cami

[milenio3]

The neighbours will love you when you fire it up.

Gary

Just make sure to aim the exhausts to THEIR house! MMmhhhuuuaaaa!!

[airdave]

The canopy looks great, the plane looks great and it will look even better in a golden paint scheme, another beauty beauty Dave!

Cami

did you just call me "beauty dave"?
I'm blushing.

[willygoat]

The neighbours will love you when you fire it up.

Gary

Yeah, because it will melt all of the snow from the driveway!

[airdave]

what snow? I'm probably further south than you are. lol

[MacSongLi]

Dave, I think williegoat still has a couple of degrees of latitude on you.

Gary

[Cami]

did you just call me "beauty dave"?
I'm blushing.

LOL! I should have previewed this one before to submit it. Lesson learned, I will be more careful in the future. The Tutor still is a beauty though.;)

Cami

[airdave]

dammit, I swear she was winking at me, your honour!

Must be the old "dirt in my eye" story again.

[14thWarrior]

Dave,

I didn't realize we were located so close to each other. I live in Kitchener; and I work in Cambridge. :)

I also don't know how this thread got away from me so quickly! All of a sudden, I was 5 pages of posts behind in reading! I'm caught up now; and wow, the progress you've made is amazing! Your test build is absolutely beautiful! I'm looking forward to seeing your next build of this model, with the Golden Centennaires paint scheme.

[airdave]

Dave,

I didn't realize we were located so close to each other. I live in Kitchener; and I work in Cambridge. :)

I also don't know how this thread got away from me so quickly! All of a sudden, I was 5 pages of posts behind in reading! I'm caught up now; and wow, the progress you've made is amazing! Your test build is absolutely beautiful! I'm looking forward to seeing your next build of this model, with the Golden Centennaires paint scheme.


Then we must meet up one day!

...
Working on the Landing Gear at the moment.
Its the only thing I haven't finished (since i didn't need it for the Snowbirds build).
Trying to come up with a detailed look, but fewest parts for simpler assembly.

Oh, and wing tanks.
I instructed Nobi to give me wing pylons and inner and outer tanks
(along with the inboard diesel tanks for the smoke).
This gives me a few options for the standard RCAF versions.

[airdave]

I have started on the second test build...of a Golden Centennaires Tutor
Hopefully this will be a full walkthrough Build with no issues.
I have started a thread here:
http://www.papermodelers.com/forum/dave-winfields-projects/34563-lets-build-cl-41-tutor-jet-photo-walkthrough.html#post511889

Everything is going well so far, I am already half way through the build.
I decided to delay the start of a build thread just in case. lol

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/Tutor%20Gold%20Build/gold-tutor-build%2041.jpg

[14thWarrior]

Totally frikkin' awesome! This latest post, and the new thread.

What weight paper do you use for the fuselage pieces?

[airdave]

I use 65lb Staples Cardstock (not Cover stock) for just about everything I do.
I print formers on regular copy paper (22lb?) and glue to cereal box card (about 1mm).

I keep 110lb cardstock as well, for those large things that need a bit more stiffening.

[Mike1158]

Nice to see the standard hasn't slipped. Nice one Dave.

[jabez]

lovely Model . I'd love to give it a go myself, I'm trying to build up a collection of as many RCAF types as I can..paper, die cast, plast-ick..(now that I'm retired and grounded I have the time) Tutor is a hard one to find. . Are the templates available anywhere? Also interested in the other variants mentioned especially the 1967 Centenary version, remember seeing them flying over Expo in 67 as a kid, it's one of the things that inspired me to join the RCAF

[airdave]

I would suggest you go back and start at the beginning of this thread
because I am still in the design and testing phase of the CL-41 model.
The Snowbirds version is almost completed.

You can also look to the second test prototype build, here:
http://www.papermodelers.com/forum/dave-winfields-projects/34563-lets-build-cl-41-tutor-jet-photo-walkthrough.html#post513169

[jabez]

Must have missed that - (DOH!) Thanks Dave!

[airdave]

Its time! for a golden goose!

I will be working on publishing the next CL-41 Tutor in the next few minutes! yay

But first, just wanted to point out a small error in the Tutor model Instructions.

I have fixed the error, and updated future kits
as well as the Snowbirds kit in the store (since its the only published model so far).
Its not a huge error, but it might lead you to install a part upside down
if you haven't paid attention to any of the build photos.

Part 87 (right and left) are shown in the diagram upside down, with the skinny edge to the bottom.
It should go to the top, with the wider tab to the bottom.
As in this updated diagram (below)

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/CT114%20Tutor/CL41%20INSTRUCT%20ERROR.jpg

Make a note on your Instruction pages...or a note next to the part...and pay attention to my photos of the finished model.

[14thWarrior]

That's model #2 purchased. :)

[herky]

bought the golden one today

[YankeeBoy]

Thanks for the timely correction, Dave. Got the updated file from eCard today.

[14thWarrior]

I am finally ready to get to work building my own copy of the CT-114/CL-41. I'm starting with the Snowbirds version first.

It took me a while to get all my supplies and equipment gathered. The trickiest supplies to get was appropriately colored markers for edge coloring the cut pieces. I ended up bringing a printout of some of the pieces of the model to Curry's Art Supplies store and through a lot of trial and error found some Prismacolor Premier art markers that match the model's colors fairly well.

I also bought a ream of the 65lb stock from Staples; though I don't think I really needed that. When I finally got it together with my 110lb stock, I finally realized that they are in fact very similar thickness because they are different "types" of cardstock. The Staples brand stock is Cover stock; whereas the Domtar brand stock I already had is Index stock. So although their basis weight in lbs is very different; there is only 23g/sm difference between them. The Staples cardstock is 176gsm, while the Domtar cardstock is 199gsm.

There are noticeable differences in the appearance and texture of the cardstocks, though. The Staples stock isn't quite a bright white as the Domtar stock; but it's texture is just slightly smoother. Prints on the Domtar stock look very good on the Domtar stock using the nice high end Canon color laser printer I have access to. It'll be interesting to print the same stuff on the Staples stock to compare.

The only thing I don't have ready is the vacuforming rig to make the clear canopy (and hopefully clear nosecone); but I've got time to get that together.

I'm excited to get started.

[airdave]

I've got a few canopies made now...you can have one if you want to pick it up.

I'll check and see if there any upcoming Toy shows at Bingemans.
I sell Hot Wheels and other toys at those shows.
I could always bring a canopy to the show.
(You're also welcome to pick it up at my home in Cambridge)

You won't need it for a while...so let me know when you are ready.
(if you haven't already figured out your own option)

[14thWarrior]

You're right, I won't need the canopy for a while; but, I'm also looking forward to trying my hand at vacuforming my own canopy. I've got the material I need to put a vacuum forming box together; and plan on building that soon.

I'll keep your offer in mind if my attempts at vacuum forming fail. :D

[airdave]

Just made a couple of (small) changes to my latest Tutor kit that I am working on
and decided to update all the Tutor kits with the same mods.

Small changes, you might not even be concerned.
But, if you bought any of the Tutors (Snowbirds, Tebuan, Golden Cent.)
you can go to ecardmodels and re-download the kits (through your account)
and you'll get the latest version with the mods.

I am just getting ready to publish the fourth CL-41 model, this time it is the natural metal finish RCAF Trainer.
And I have just started work on the fifth instalment...a Red Knight Tutor.

From the very first Tutor kit, I have been promising myself that I was going to adjust those side "deflectors" that fit into the jet Engine intakes.
The deflectors are slightly offset, as they should be,
but I didn't like the very thin pointed sliver of material on one side.
And the very thick section on the other side.
This goes back to the original work Nobi did for me...and I wanted to make a small design change, but never did. My fault.

But after building the new RCAF Tutor I decided to modify the shape a little bit
...you will hardly notice it. But its enough to strengthen the thin side of that part, and move the deflector down a little bit.

And as I said, I have modified the deflectors in all previous kits.

Deflectors in this photo have NOT been modified.
http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/New%20Model%20%20Releases/DSC_0838.jpg

...
And, while photographing this latest RCAF Tutor, I noticed how high the plane sits at the rear.

I must explain, that the original prototype model sat way too low (compared to the real plane).
The tail is supposed to sit a little higher that the cockpit.
And since I was redesigning the Landing Gear (more than once), I compensated and increased the stance of the plane.

But after photographing this latest build, from the side, I see that it sits a bit too high.
The spine of the fuselage should be closer to horizontal.
So, I have shortened the Main Landing Gear a little bit to drop it down.
Not much...about 2mm in total.

Probably not going to notice the change until you view the model directly from the side
but it should be more accurate this way.

And, as said, I have modified all the Tutor kits with the slightly shorter Landing Gear struts.

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l588/cutandfold/New%20Model%20%20Releases/RCAF%20Tutor%207.jpg

These aren't big modifications...just little things that bugged me.
But I wanted to make sure everyone is aware of the changes and you can decide if you want to replace the kits in your collection.

[14thWarrior]

How many different liveries are you planning to do for the CL-41?

[airdave]

Done so far:
Snowbirds (CAF, Aerobatic)
Golden Centennaires (RCAF, 1967 Aerobatic)
Malaysian Tebuan (RMAF, Ground Attack Fighter)

RCAF (1970 Trainer)...ready to be published

Working on:
Red Knight (Canadian AF Training Command, Aerobatic)

Future consideration, but not planned:
CL-41R Experimental
Canada Forces Type 4 Trainer (last version of the Trainer, newer markings)
AETE CL-41 (Canadian Aerospace Test platform)

There are some civilian versions, since all but the Snowbirds aircraft were sold off to civilian pilots...
John Travolta owned one! lol
...but I haven't got much info on any of those.
So nothing planned.
Probably not much of a market for those anyway.

[14thWarrior]

Good to know. I'm definitely in for the 1970 RCAF trainer and the Red Knight. I would definitely buy an AETE version too, if you decided to do that one; I love the look of that livery. I'm still mulling over whether or not I want to get the RMAF Tebuan.

[airdave]

Please document your build of the Snowbirds kit
or at least show us the final outcome.
As I said, if you need help, just let me know.
You are also welcome to pick up a canopy.

I don't know about the AETE version yet...but maybe you can test build it (if I ever decide to create it).

[14thWarrior]

I'll do my best to document my build of the Snowbirds kit. So far, I've printed all the sheets and clearcoated them. I've started laminating internal formers to double thickness heavy card.

I also assembled a spare copy of the nose cone (inside out) and filled it with 5 minute epoxy to start forming the positive mould for eventual vacuum forming a clear nose cone. I have a lot of work to do on it to get it to final shape; but the initial result with the epoxy is promising.

I'll have to post an image of the headlight plate(s) I drew up for the model, assuming creating a clear nose cone works out.

I'll post pics soon-ish.

[airdave]

Oh wow! I almost forgot about that!
Thanks for reminding me.

I did up parts for the Nose a while back (when we first discussed this)
but I never got around to making up a file to share.

Heres a quick PDF of all the parts for both versions (early and late).

CL41 NOSE DETAILS (http://www.mediafire.com/download/drqvmw8q9vxgue4/CL41_NOSE_DETAILS.pdf)

Maybe, if you have success making a nose canopy, you could share it with me?
or share the mold for it?
I could try it myself.

And, if I ever do decide to market the Cockpit Canopy, I can include the Nose piece.

[Tecumseh]

link does not seem to work to the PDF

[airdave]

Yeah, thats the forum trying to automatically change the link to a text line...messes up the link every time.
Lets repost this...since I can't edit the original post...

Oh wow! I almost forgot about that!
Thanks for reminding me.

I did up parts for the Nose a while back (when we first discussed this)
but I never got around to making up a file to share.

Heres a quick PDF of all the parts for both versions (early and late).

CL41 Nose Parts PDF (http://www.mediafire.com/download/drqvmw8q9vxgue4/CL41_NOSE_DETAILS.pdf)

Maybe, if you have success making a nose canopy, you could share it with me?
or share the mold for it?
I could try it myself.

And, if I ever do decide to market the Cockpit Canopy, I can include the Nose piece.

[14thWarrior]

The link below is a the headlight plate that I drew up. I probably went overboard with some details, given how small they end up when printed. I probably also provided myself with more "3D" parts than necessary.

CT-114_Headlight_Plate_for_Clear_Nosecone (http://www.mediafire.com/view/82g8tyw6re4qlup/CT-114_Headlight_Plate_for_Clear_Nosecone.pdf)

I'll gladly share a nose canopy with you if it succeeds. In fact, I think I might build a second mold now, so that if it does succeed I'll already have a spare mold to share. :)

Here are a couple of images of the nosecone mold in its early stages of existence.

http://www.bighippiegames.com/lib/exe/fetch.php?media=ct114_nosecone_mold_initial.jpg

http://www.bighippiegames.com/lib/exe/fetch.php?media=ct114_nosecone_mold_detail_2.jpg

In the images above, you can see that I've only just started to scrape away the cardstock used to produce the initial form. I drew a vertical line down the centre just to remind me which way it needs to be oriented, until I can refine the shape. I'll probably use epoxy putty to build any low spots up, and to build a skirt around it for better results while vacuum forming.

[14thWarrior]

As for the broken link in Dave's post, there's a simple workaround. You need only copy the link, which ends up looking like "http://www.papermodelers.com/forum/redirect-to/?redirect=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mediafire.com%2Fdownloa d%2Fdrqvmw8q9vxgue4%2FCL41_NOSE_DETAILS.pdf" then strip everything from the beginning to the = sign. After that replace the "%3A" with ":" and every "%2F" with "/" and you should be off to the races.

[airdave]

As for the broken link in Dave's post, there's a simple workaround. You need only copy the link, which ends up looking like "http://www.papermodelers.com/forum/redirect-to/?redirect=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mediafire.com%2Fdownloa d%2Fdrqvmw8q9vxgue4%2FCL41_NOSE_DETAILS.pdf" then strip everything from the beginning to the = sign. After that replace the "%3A" with ":" and every "%2F" with "/" and you should be off to the races.

Okay, now the followup/repeat post stopped working.

What is going on with this forum?
I used to post links really easy, but now the posts are automatically altered when publishing and links sometimes don't work.
I even tried typing text, and then hot linking it...but now it has changed and doesn't work again.

I see that 14thwarrior's link is corrupt too.

I want to type the direct access to the file...can we turn off this auto-changing of the link?

And yesterday I had a nightmare time with "tags".
I was creating a longish post, that required me to "preview" a few times to check structure and spelling.
but everytime I previewed, it added a new set of tags...way too many tags, so that it gave me a warning.
I would delete all tags...and the next preview created a whole new set of too many tags!

[airdave]

I added the Nose Detail parts to my Extras section at www.papermodelshop.com (http://www.papermodelshop.com)
You can download it there.

[airdave]

Took a trip last week over to Canada Forces Base Borden to visit their Museum.
Was also hoping to visit the Aircraft hangar Museum, but unfortunately it was closed at the time.

Regardless, the Regimental Museum and Memorial Park are really great.
Plenty of cool stuff to see.

One half of the regimental Museum is dedicated to the RCAF.
And they have a small display window setup for the Snowbirds.

They also have a Instrument/Cockpit Trainer for the CT-114 Tutor (in Snowbirds colours too).
I took some video and a couple of photos.
Cool to see a fully equipped cockpit.

Unfortunately some of my video didn't focus well, so what I have left is fairly short, sorry.
But, I put it together anyway and uploaded it.
View it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RD9NB2f7rk

3RD9NB2f7rk