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Keds_Girl_Lala
06-10-2009, 01:58 PM
I have the nice Orel Potemkin kit. But it is also more complicated for me. Now I have been given the Maly Modelarz Potemkin. It is old but not so complicated. However, it has very bad color registration and fade ink. Also the paper that should be white is deeply yellow or ugly grey.

So, I have for about a week, been working on to fix the image so I can reprint the ship to build. It is not so complicated as the Aurora (I don't think?)...

So here is a sample of what I start with... You can see my problems:

1) color of paper itself
2) registration of the red is mistaken
3) the colors they are all mottled and not solid
4) The black it is not black and you can see overprint colors as around the blue port holes.
5) the paper itself it is mushy and spongy.


http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/PotemkinBefore.jpg

So now after many hours effort I have this:

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/PotemkinAfter.jpg

I have reduce the model to just black and white only. Then, I use the best example of the color from the original ink and transfer it to the clean version. So the colors they are bright and clean now. When I print, I can see ok I like this or not... but it is easy to change a color now since the red is one red... the yellow it is one yellow.

There is about 9 sheet of parts for me to recolor. I estimate perhaps it take me two hours per sheet some time. I can progress in a certain amount and then find what I do is not what I need so I have to start anew. But I have three fourths of it finish now.

member_3
06-10-2009, 02:06 PM
Your re-colored version is probably better than the original was when it was new! I may have to try this procedure on a few of my 20+ year old Maly Modelarz models. I will be watching this with interest.

Tim Crowe
06-10-2009, 02:07 PM
It's a shame the film is in black and white. Apart from that it's a good source of detail shots.

Tim

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-10-2009, 02:08 PM
Thank you! It is much effort. It has taken me a lot of time so I have not make anything since I finish the Coleoptere. But I have also been ill some weeks. This will fix some issued I have when I try the Aurora like the color of the parts not being the same when the sides they were in three pieces each and each one was not the same!

THE DC
06-10-2009, 02:12 PM
Looks excellent. Good improvement!

I'd comment more, but I've got this strange PM just now to translate....


The DC

Wilfried
06-10-2009, 02:19 PM
Hello Lala,

good reproduction of black and white! Very well done and sharper than the old Maly ... but take a look at the deck bleached teak and the hull red ... reducing of red and yellow should be better ... just my only 2 cents ..

with lovely greetings
the Wilfried

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-10-2009, 02:25 PM
Yes I know the color is not per a real ship really but it is per the model. As I say, when I print the page I can adjust the color then if I feel it is too bright. I found already once I make some colors too subtle. They look ok on my computer but as I print them, they come out much different. Firstly I wanted not to change the model but to make the model as it SHOULD have been when it was printed with the colors that was intended for it.

Plus I have the nice Orel model if I want fancy color. I think some parts here that Maly Modelarz has for white they should be cream color.

Wilfried
06-10-2009, 02:33 PM
Hello Lala,

I'm not supposed to critisize your idea, that I now understand; you like to give an old Maly the look that a Maly have to be. Fine!

With lovely greetings
the Wilfried

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-10-2009, 02:37 PM
Oh it is not criticism. I just explain my process. First I make it look as it was intended... then, if I want it is now easier to change a color.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-11-2009, 09:06 AM
I look now today at some other interpretation of the Potemkin. I feel the chimney and perhaps the bottom of the masts they are a peach color. The Orel kit it is this way. I notice (I do not like the idea) that Orel they make the wood deck and the chimney the same color all. I will study the Potemkin instructional drawing and determine the number for the parts to tint with peach color instead of white. I think also the model it has the turrets in white but they will be black.

Royaloakmin
06-11-2009, 12:33 PM
There is some controversy about whether Orel got the colors right. My suggestion would be to tone down the red to something a bit more orange and make the yellow decks a light tan. I think you are right to practice with a simpler model before you tackle a Orel kit.

member_3
06-11-2009, 12:56 PM
I can state emphatically that no underwater hull paint I have encountered in the Navy or at a ship yard was a bright red. These paints were all (until recent times) a red lead type anti-fouling, anti-corrosion paint. They are best represented by a dull (tending toward brown) red. There were also some copper-based anti-fouling paints that were a dull medium green. Wooden decks of all eras tend to bleach to pale tan especially when religiously "holy stoned" by their crew. I recall a learned (and pretty boring) article by a paint expert in my IPMS days (40 years ago) that talked about the effect fo scale upon the human eye/brain interpretation of color. The bottom line was that a given color will appear brighter on a small scale model than it does on the 1:1 scale real thing.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-11-2009, 01:17 PM
Yes I know the color on real ship is not so bright... But as I say it is the color the model it was printed in first. So I just make the model the color it was. I do not ask what color it is I know it is not so bright already.

I also explain that now that when the color it is clean, I can print the page and see how it actually look. Again as I say once, I had made some color on another model very realistic on my computer but when I print the color was so pale and almost invisible. So this is not how the model will look exactly when I finish.

On the Orel kit it looks ok for the red. It is a brownish shade. I would call it Russet. But they make the deck a pink color like the chimney on the Orel kit so I would not make my kit the same way.

The Cruiser Aurora she is green below the water.

THe package for the Orel Potemkin cover shows the actual ship and she is grey not black. In the movie the ship is not black (It is not Potemkin either) but she is grey. I think that boat shown is the Dvienadsat Apostolov Twelve Apostle .

member_3
06-11-2009, 02:38 PM
Oops, I think I got a bit long-winded and preachy there... Just so there is no misunderstanding, I am not criticizing your great restoration of a very tired and worn old model - I think you are doing a fantastic job of bringing it back to life as it was originally printed (and, in addition, correcting the color registration.) You are absolutely correct in that your restoration is an excellent starting point for correcting the colors to a more realistic level. You are doing a wonderful job and obviously have a good knowledge of the subject. I will continue to follow this restoration and build with great interest.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-11-2009, 02:47 PM
Oh it is all well! Some time also my English it is not as clear and I am excitable!

I have one page with bad off set on the color. And the black lines are vague in some spot. So it is hard. There are duplicate items there so I fix one and then cut and paste for the number I need instead of to fix each one singly. I find a pirate scan of the model on line with that page inked better than mine, but the format it is not good so if I use that for some parts it is not the same size. The main part that it is so poor is the long vanes that go along the side of the red part of the bottom. I think I will just draw a box around them and make it all red and cut the part out to size directly.

mabrown
06-12-2009, 04:48 AM
Wonderful thread Lala. I bought my first ever paper model kit on ebay a couple of weeks ago, a Maly HMS Dido, so this is very instructional.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-12-2009, 09:59 AM
Hi Mabrown for your help I have make some step by step commentary pictures. It will help with the Dido or other models. I use the page from my Potemkin for example but the work is the same.

I use Gimp which I get free on line as a down load. It works very well. I have Paint Shop Pro which I buy from Target. But I do this work here today for this example with Gimp. Some time I find a tool in Gimp and Paint Shop (like Curve) they have the same name and function but one does not work the same or as good or is better. So if it does not do what I need in one program, I may use the other for that.

First open your page then also make a copy to work from.

So here is the first part. I use this page from the Potemkin becuase it show the poor paper color, bad printing registration for the red, blotchy color on the red, etc. It also has more colors - white, red, black, yellow... Notice the red is off set to the right a few millimeter...

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Test1.jpg


So, the first thing is to make your page basically a black and white drawing so you can recolor it. For this I go to "Color", and drop down to "Threshold". It has a slide bar you can use to make the image black and white.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Test2.jpg

Now the page it look 100% better! Use your original page now to use color picker to get the colors back to recolor. I am describing to make the page look as it was intended. Not to change color or make it different color than the original (for now!). You can see I start to fill in the color areas with the Paint Fill Bucket.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Test3.jpg


Now, some time this happen... Use "Edit" and "Undo" to reverse the flood of paint. It is make when there is a hole in the black line you are to fill in with the Bucket.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Test4.jpg
"

You can see the holes here. 1) is the hole and 2) is the hole with some Red paint with a paint brush or pen to fill the hole. Then use Paint Bucket to fill again properly.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Test5.jpg

Now it look correct!

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Test6.jpg


Now that you have the idea. If you want different colors to use. It work the same way. You can use the color choices to make things more subdue or to add more color. I make the life boat look more like wood and depth of shadow. Some part on the Battleship Potemkin they are cream color also but Maly Modelarz make them white... So I fix that here...

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Test7.jpg


There are some tools too. You find under "Filters" then "Light and Shadow" and then to "Drop Shadow". It make things like this on the life boats. I also use a perspective filter on one. It is an idea at least to make some thing more 3D. I just show it for you I do not use it myself on the Potemkin.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Test9.jpg


Now also if you make a lot of pieces one color, like the red. But say Okay I do not like that... You do not have to refill each area again all over. Go to "Colors" and to "Map" and "Color Exchange". There you will have a box to put the original color into. Then there is a box to put the "to" color into. So here I go fom Red to Blue. Color Replace it replace all the red in one click.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Test8.jpg


I learn this in about two weeks. But I have much help and support from people here who provide me with some basic idea of things to do and to try. But foremost it was to just experiment. I hope it help other people also.

member_3
06-12-2009, 10:10 AM
Thank you for sharing this procedure. I will put it to good use in the near future.

BARX2
06-12-2009, 11:46 AM
Wow! That is a great tutorial! I hope you will upload it to the web site to help others. I always wondered how to recolor a model and you explained it very clearly and made it look easy. Thanks, Lala! You are becoming an expert paper modeler in a short time. :)

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-12-2009, 11:51 AM
How can I upload it? I am not opposed. Or I can re-write.

jyduchene
06-12-2009, 12:17 PM
I don't post often, or often enough. I have to say you have taught me several important things in a brief space. I have photoshop elements and I believe I can do most of what you have shown. Thank you for the informantion. You clearly know your stuff. I have no advise only appreciation. John

redhorse
06-12-2009, 06:31 PM
Thanks Lala, that's really helpful. Now I just have to figure out how to get a good scan that actually will print at the size I want it too...

Yu Gyokubun
06-12-2009, 06:54 PM
Thanks Lala for the specific explanation. I'll save this tutorial in my HD as a bible of recoloring

Yu

mabrown
06-13-2009, 07:40 AM
Thanks so much for the excellent tutorial Lala!

Golden Bear
06-13-2009, 12:56 PM
That IS worth saving for people, Lala. Nicely done.

If I may add... In PSP there is also a "Color Replacer" function where you choose the background color to be replaced and the foreground that you want it to be. It works otherwise like a paint brush except that it ignores everything outside the range of color that you select.

The reason that I mention this is that I find it handy to use in company with the Fill function. Sometimes I just go quickly around the inside edge of a region that I want to fill, in case there are those gaps that she showed. Then I fill in the void.


Carl

ct ertz
06-13-2009, 01:05 PM
I just download Gimp from the link on Ecardmodels.com and I am going to play around for a bit. Thank you for the great info!

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-13-2009, 01:07 PM
Thank you all. I find Gimp myself by just Googling it. I will try the PSP tool also. But for now I can not print thing right and I fear I might have to start over again and keep track of size better. In that case I don't know if I will bother...

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-15-2009, 11:09 AM
Now I start with the template for the hull of the ship. I had buy some 1mm, 2mm etc card from Paper Model Store but I do not like it. I find it is soft and mushy like the back of a paper page tablet. So I use 1/32 inch Bass Wood. It match the size of the notches on the print template very well and it is more firm, obviously. I fix the paper to the wood with spray cement. Even being hard, it cuts not so difficult .

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Template.jpg

Barry
06-15-2009, 11:43 AM
Cornflake packets laminated to 150 gsm hard card work very well

BARX2
06-15-2009, 12:08 PM
I've used thin balsa, but not basswood. I would think it would be too hard to cut. But it definitely will be strong!

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-15-2009, 01:07 PM
It is not so hard to cut. In a way it cut easeir than very thick cardboard. And the fine work, it is done against a ruler.

I pick this becuase I want to sand the frame to make it smooth. I have thought of the idea of filling the void areas in the frame with foam and sanding to shape. Then I can fix the card skin over the foam very smoothly. I want this to be very good.

When I make some work on the Aurora I had laminated card stock and bristol board. It work very well but it was time consuming to make and cut out.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-16-2009, 10:00 AM
Well I get 3/4 the parts finish until I cut my thumb badly cutting along a ruler :-(

But here is many of the template parts now. I fix the card stock to wood with Elmers Craft Bond spray adhesive. It does not make any stain on the paper and it does not bow the wood.

Then I cut the parts mostly with a ruler except the curve which I must do free hand. I cut my hand with the knife along the ruler and I have to stop work for today... but this is how far I get...

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/cutframe.jpg

The long parts for the shape of the boat they come in at least two parts. For the top and bottom profile template, I can glue some wood on the far side to make the joint stiff. But for the top shape of the boat (it is not the deck but the shape at the water-line) the wood must join just on edge. There is a side template that glue next to this joint and so you can not overlap it with wood on the bottom. I trace the location for the mail bottom template along the middle shape part with a permanant pen.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/bottomframe.jpg

It is some what confusing Modelarz they will lable the parts for the top half of the ship P 1, P 5, W 1, W 6 etc. But for the lower parts they are P I, P V, W I, W VI etc.

Michael Mash
06-16-2009, 11:00 AM
Looking forward to seeing how this goes. So far so good. (Take care of that injury!)
Mike

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-16-2009, 11:15 AM
thank you actually my finger it bothers me greatly now

cMags
06-16-2009, 12:42 PM
If I may add... In PSP there is also a "Color Replacer" function where you choose the background color to be replaced and the foreground that you want it to be. It works otherwise like a paint brush except that it ignores everything outside the range of color that you select.

Paintshop Pro's color replacer function not only allows you to use it as a paintbrush, but if you double-click, it will globally replace the color (or replace within the active selection if you want to limit your area but not have to paint it by hand).

Thanks for the tips - You're doing a great job on the repaint. I'm familiar with a lot of these tricks myself, but there's always a bit to learn and different ways to do things. Gotta pick 'em up one at a time. :)

Peter Epps
06-16-2009, 02:04 PM
HI,
I love building boats but I have have not used basswood either. (balsa yes)It sort of takes you into primeval paper, wood. For some ships I laminate 2 sheets of card stock. (100#) But the formers are some of the most important parts of the ship, giving you the platform for everything else. As for gluing the patterns to the wood I would use heat transfer glue sheets as opposed to spray adhesive. Just a personal preference. So much for my 2 cents. I am interested to see how your project continues.

BARX2
06-16-2009, 02:19 PM
Lala, sorry to hear about your finger. I've cut off my fingertips several times and it's always a shock when it happens. I cut my finger so badly last month that I needed to go to the emergency room to get stitched up, but the odd thing is that it didn't happen by cutting paper. I was taking a single edge razor out of a package to put it into a box cutter. The blade slipped in my fingers and the sharp side went deeply into my finger, requiring stitches. Maybe you don't want to hear that now. Sorry. Hope it heals quickly.

Phil
06-16-2009, 03:24 PM
Looks really good Keds_Girl_Lala...sorry I was late! lol:D

Wilfried
06-16-2009, 03:59 PM
Hello Lala,

sorry about your finger! Friends of mine use for rulers, formers balsa wood; or in combination with grey cardboard - very heavy and strong - their jigsaw ...

With lovely greetings
the Wilfried

dansls1
06-16-2009, 04:02 PM
Get well soon, I enjoy seeing your builds (and don't want you to be hurt regardless) ;)

redhorse
06-16-2009, 08:36 PM
Good luck with the finger, but now you've got modeling scars!! My fingerprints are all X shaped now.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-17-2009, 03:09 PM
Well my finger it is still very bad and bleeds still for the second day. But I can not go to the doctor for it... I still manage to make the last few parts. I think I make 6 today... There is some blood on the white paper :-(

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Potemkin.jpg

You can see above there is some work around where the rudder will go (like to fill the slot) and perhaps foam here it will make things more smooth to blend from the curve hull to the flat part?

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Stern.jpg

And I glue the forms together. I glue the long templates to the ship outline with Aleene's glue then the cross pieces all with Zap A Gap glue. Then I go back with Aleene's... I make one minor mistake... the forms on the bottom below the water line they are not totally in line with the forms above. But this will not impact any thing. The parts for the bottom go on the bottom only and the parts for the top on the top only.

If you look above at the very back there is small part P1a... Now why this is not just print as part of P1 is not understood. P1 it is not so long it wont fit on the page with P1a attach!?!

Papercut
06-17-2009, 03:25 PM
So if your blood is apart of the ship, then the saying apart of me is in this is true of your great build. I always look forward to your postings. I am looking forward to seeing what you will do with this Grand Ship of the Line. I was surprised @your choice of bass wood to work with, very firm/hard but wonderfully straight wood to work with. So far you are doing a great job. If you are still bleeding from the wound I suggest you go to MD to insure all is well.:DRick

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-17-2009, 03:47 PM
Well I find Basswood surprisingly at Ace Hardware ?!? and in 1/32 it is about 1.5mm and not so hard to cut.

It is not possible to get medical advise, sadly. But I have a friend who is to help me with my finger tonight and she have bandages, salve etc. I have cut into my finger about .5 cm by .5cm

ct ertz
06-17-2009, 03:50 PM
KGL, I have boiled horse hair and a good needle! That worked well for many a wounded Confederate soldier during the American Civil War, could give that a try!

In all seriousness, I hope that you start healing soon, and keep it clean. AT least cuts made by real sharp things do tend to heal quicker, once they start healing that is. Good luck to you.

And your build is coming along nice though.

CT.

Wilfried
06-17-2009, 04:04 PM
It is not possible to get medical advise, sadly. But I have a friend who is to help me with my finger tonight and she have bandages, salve etc. I have cut into my finger about .5 cm by .5cm

Sorry Lala,

in which country you live? Somalia, North Corea, Iraq, Afghanistan .. all countries we support ... I wish you, that you can get help in the land of glory!

With lovely greetings
the Wilfried, I'm shocked to hear of that ..

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-17-2009, 04:12 PM
Thank you. I will be okay! Unless something it is very grave It is not really possible for me to ask for assistance.

Zathros
06-17-2009, 07:22 PM
I have used Crazy Glue Gel for some really sharp razor cuts ( I am a machinist) and repaired a 1 inch slice on my finger that a doctor said should have had stitches but healed excellent never the less. It burns bad but kills germs and really holds the skin together. A medical version of crazy glue is used in surgeries. Squeeze it tight before you apply the glue and line up your fingerprint lines, as they will stay in the position they heal in. I offer this remedy with no medical background, only personal experience, for God's sake use your own judgment and if there is any sign of infection do not seal up the cut and go to a doctor.

eatcrow2
06-17-2009, 08:11 PM
I have used Crazy Glue Gel for some really sharp razor cuts ( I am a machinist) and repaired a 1 inch slice on my finger that a doctor said should have had stitches but healed excellent never the less. It burns bad but kills germs and really holds the skin together. A medical version of crazy glue is used in surgeries. Squeeze it tight before you apply the glue and line up your fingerprint lines, as they will stay in the position they heal in. I offer this remedy with no medical background, only personal experience, for God's sake use your own judgment and if there is any sign of infection do not seal up the cut and go to a doctor.

Have done the same, and keep some in my mini first aid kit I have on job sites.. Especially on cuts on the inside of the hands, where you can never get a band-aid to stay on while working.

shrike
06-17-2009, 10:00 PM
That's what superglue was invented for actually.

(I used to own stock in the company - would have lost my shirt if it wasn't stuck to my fingers)

dansls1
06-17-2009, 10:27 PM
I have used Crazy Glue Gel for some really sharp razor cuts ( I am a machinist) and repaired a 1 inch slice on my finger that a doctor said should have had stitches but healed excellent never the less. It burns bad but kills germs and really holds the skin together. A medical version of crazy glue is used in surgeries. Squeeze it tight before you apply the glue and line up your fingerprint lines, as they will stay in the position they heal in. I offer this remedy with no medical background, only personal experience, for God's sake use your own judgment and if there is any sign of infection do not seal up the cut and go to a doctor.

I read a study in the American Medical Journal one time (buddy is a Dr.) where they researched switching from stitches to using cyanoacrylate for many cuts. The ultimate conclusion was that it worked just as well, but the training required to change from stitches to using it made it too cost ineffective to change. And don't worry about contamination, superglue polymerizes (solidifies) on contact with water, that's why it sticks so much better to your skin than most things you are trying to glue ;)

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-18-2009, 06:30 AM
Do not worry my finger it is fix now (mostly) LOL. My partner she is versed in things like bandages, etc. She had to trim some of the skin back and now it close up well and I just have it covered and with some aniseptic salve. It is just the location that make it awkward. You can buy glue for cuts in the store. I have some self-sealing spray for when you have a big scrape and you just spray it across the top and it form a hard aniseptic scab that bond over the wound. I have that spray in my tennis bag in case of a fall on the court.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-18-2009, 09:53 AM
Today I quickly make up some of the parts for the front deck. Now, you can see also how I fix the color from the bright yellow. But that was always my plan. This is just a sample... I think the sections for the hull that are print in black for the outside and white for the part you dont see... I will make those all black so if it does not line up so well it will not show. Those horizontal parts will be affix to wood also. I have to test fit many parts beucase nothing is exactly even... the shape of the deck it does not match the shape of the middle of the ship, etc. But so far I can visualize things much better with just placing a few parts.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/deck-2.jpg

eatcrow2
06-18-2009, 10:06 AM
Deck color looks perfect!!!

Michael Mash
06-18-2009, 10:52 AM
Looking good. Glad that injury has not slowed you down.
Mike

rockpaperscissor
06-18-2009, 11:06 AM
This is shaping up very nicely. Those primary colors in your early posts had me worried, but I'm beginning to see your vision. The basswood was a great choice for the formers. I've always wanted to build a ship, but they're so involved, and have so many pieces, that I think I'd burn out long before finishing. I'm very interested in watching your progress.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-18-2009, 11:34 AM
Thank you. Yes I am happy with the color now. But it was always my idea to adjust them. But first I have to take the original speckly colors and just make them one solid color. Then I have to print that and see how it really looks. Then I can adjust the color to the way I want it next. I will not change most color... Some parts they are white and should be peach color so I fix that... I think the gun towers they should be black also but they are printed for white.

birder
06-18-2009, 11:39 AM
Looks good Lala! I do the same thing with kits if the colors are not what I would like. Will be watching your ship with interest as I have not built a more modern type ship yet at all.:)

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-18-2009, 01:00 PM
I have some good ideas as to how to make the model more smooth and solid. The decking I will make from a wood template as well. This will be flat and straight and I can bring the paper sides up neatly and cleanly. For the paper printed wood deck, the Potemkin she has a black border which will be handy here. Perhaps I will seal and paint the edge of the wooden deck black, and then cut away the printed wood boards and glue them centered over the wood so it is all neat and clean.

The instructions (in Polish) they hint at some thing like this where they show tracing the shape of the deck onto card board then cutting the border area away and gluing the wood part over the larger card part.
http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/decking.jpg

So I make some fast black and white decks to mount to the wood...

Yu Gyokubun
06-18-2009, 10:52 PM
Lala, I simply like your style, in a short time since you have showed up out of nowhere you have been conjuring up new idea after idea. Go on this way but do not burn out on us by trying too hard. I need your positive attitude towards paper modeling that vitalizes me;)

shrike
06-18-2009, 11:20 PM
And don't overlook the appeal of a pretty blond girl that can debate tank variations and obsolete IRBM designations too<G>

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-19-2009, 07:23 AM
LOL thank you for the kind words. I have just many interest. And the internet it facilitate to learn. I will read book, news, history, and to look things up that I see someone else they have like a missile launcher. It is a huge opportunity to just learn things as I do not have the opportunity for school now.

To learn and have interest it keep me from being bored. I have much issues with that. I get restless and agitated. So I must always keep busy. It helps not much that I work at night, so my day I have mostly to nap or to occupy my time. Of course now my daughter she take some time but that is okay! I can be with her every day.

Sometime I feel self conscious that I do not fit the mold I appear to be. It is complicated for me. My occupation it does not match wtith my very private personal side and interests.

My electricity it was out in the heavy storm yesterday but now today my air-conditioner it is broken and the temperature will be nearly to 100 !

dansls1
06-19-2009, 08:19 AM
Nice progress. This model is certain to be solid with all that wood structure!

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-19-2009, 09:02 AM
At first I had not thought of the wood... I had buy some 1mm, 2mm, etc. card from Paper Model Store... but I find the card it is soft and not usable for what I desire. It is like the back of a tablet of writing paper and not stiff or firm. And I do not want to bother with making the laminations again. So I find the wood cheaply and the right size. The wood it also cuts easier than the card for the most part. I can cut the wood in 2 or three strokes with the knife, but very thick card it take 4-6. And for the long curves, I can make the part just outside the line and sand the edge easier to shape.

There is platforms in the middle of the ship. The guns on the sides they are recessed and this is the "floor" where they will sit above.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Middle.jpg

And the deck for the back of the ship... It is not glue in place yet. And I will remove the paper part when I am done with cutting out the edges and turret hole. I may not cut the turret hole... it will not turn really and there is just template forms below the opening.
http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/RearDeck.jpg

And the front deck. It has a very complicated edge to the hull side. I want to make this as smooth and solid so the paper fittings are flush, straight and without gaps and holes.
http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/FrontDeck.jpg

Then when I work last afternoon the power it goes out in a blinding storm and hail... Here is the hail blow up along a wall. The winds were fierce and the power it was gone a few hours. Then my air conditioner it is dead...

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/blurryhail.jpg

Royaloakmin
06-19-2009, 09:15 AM
Lala, the turrets were painted black, and white, at different times, so its your choice. Some think the peachy color is wrong, and that it should be yellow ochre.

I think you may find it harder to trim the deck after mounting, so suggest you do it first. And finally, give that hull frame a good sanding so all is smoth and nothing is poking out. You are making great progress!

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-19-2009, 09:25 AM
Lala, the turrets were painted black, and white, at different times, so its your choice. Some think the peachy color is wrong, and that it should be yellow ochre.

I think you may find it harder to trim the deck after mounting, so suggest you do it first. And finally, give that hull frame a good sanding so all is smoth and nothing is poking out. You are making great progress!

I look at models on line and see many variations. I myself I like the peach shade, as it is warm. But who know for certain! I see the model in grey and white, black and white, etc. And some model they have the masts white or peach, etc.

I do not plan to trim the deck lastly. I had just cut the decks from the wood board and slip them in place. Next I will cut the edges properly, sand them, etc and fix them with cement. Then I will sand the frames when I get all the various supports and ledges and sills in place. After that, I can perhaps fill some of the voids with soft foam.

If you notice in the picture the printed paper deck, it has a thick black border... Perhaps I will paint the edge of the wood deck black, and then just affix the printed wood part slightly centered. This will make the adding of the paper sides more simple and I can trim the top edge without cutting the paper deck.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-19-2009, 10:19 AM
I cut the final edge to the decks. The rear deck is now fixed with Weldit glue. It fits very well. I will overlay the printed boards later. Compare to the prior photo with the paper still attached...

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/X1.jpg

The front deck (important area of the ship from the mutiney) has more intricate cuts and edging. I use sand paper wrap around a small glue bottle to make the rounds in the side smooth. You can see the peel off paper now that I do not need. I will sand the very front part a bit more smooth also.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/X2.jpg

eatcrow2
06-19-2009, 10:55 AM
That's a good idea for the sandpaper!!!!! This is really coming along nicely..

SJPONeill
06-19-2009, 02:21 PM
I started using basswood last year instead of thick plastic card for load bearing parts in plastic models because it is so easy to cut while sacrificing nothing in strength. The other advantage over heavy card as Lala has already identified is that it is sandable so that (in my case) any minor wobbles in the cutting can be smoothed out...

kenlwest
06-19-2009, 06:35 PM
You are putting a lot of effort into this and it shows! Your build is much cleaner than what I would have expected from an early Modelarz. You are very talented.

Congratulations on keeping your finger! We've all been there; done that.

Can't wait to see the finished project.

Ken

Padre
06-19-2009, 11:01 PM
Looking good, can't wait to see more progress and the finished model!

redhorse
06-19-2009, 11:11 PM
This is quite impressive, I like the basswood and the precision with which you're working it.

I really enjoyed all the micro models builds, but this I think I'm going to enjoy even more!

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-20-2009, 07:46 AM
Yawn good morning! (It is early here) I was looking yesterday at the Micromodels and will have to make another as well! But this morning I will I hope put the last few wood forms in place so I can sand things smooth and even. This afternoon, if I am able, I will go to the craft store for some foam.

Phil
06-20-2009, 08:12 AM
I am in awe of your craftsmanship! Wish I could think of more to say, you are a joy to watch!

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-20-2009, 02:43 PM
Wish I could think of more to say, you are a joy to watch!

Aw me or the model? LOL :p

Any way. Today I do some work to finalize the hull forms. I fill in a small area on the front bottom for a smooth arc. In some areas the card now will peel from the wood but that is unimportant at this stage. It is just for cutting and to know the numbers initially.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Bow-3.jpg


And have the side support thingies in place now...

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Bowside.jpg



This is where the middle structure of the ship will fit...

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/BowTop.jpg

And the back. I mark two correction with yellow arrow to show where I fill with extra wood and sand back. I could not do this with card board!

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/stern-1.jpg

Phil
06-20-2009, 03:17 PM
Both! My dear!

Greg S.
06-21-2009, 01:22 PM
Nice wood work. Have you had experience with working with wood before this?

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-21-2009, 02:12 PM
I have not made a lot with wood but I had use it for the backing of my rubber stamps and for making some little decorative boxes.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-24-2009, 08:45 AM
Last nite, I buy some florist foam at Wal Mart. It is not dear and I buy a large package and small package for $3.75 combine. I have more than enough I think. Even if I am wasteful some.

It is not so hard to cut. You can slice it like a cheese with a long knife. I glue it with Aleene's Glue. Then I will sand the countours finally.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/foam.jpg

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/foam2.jpg

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/foam3.jpg

Phil
06-24-2009, 09:01 AM
You are so darn clever! I never would have thought about florists foam. It contours easily and sands smooth. Does it take paint well?

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-24-2009, 09:12 AM
You are so darn clever! I never would have thought about florists foam. It contours easily and sands smooth. Does it take paint well?

I do not know about paint... Becuse here I plan on just to put the paper over it for a solid feel. It is still porous and it is not possible I think to easily seal the surface.

Oddly Zap A Gap instant glue, it does not melt the foam. Although I am not sure it will really glue it either.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-24-2009, 11:04 AM
The foam it is very easy. you can push a bigger block against the frames and it will sink in. Then cut the indented area free and fix with glue.

Of course i cut my hand again (same hand different finger) so i stop now

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/morefoam.jpg


In the back I make some allowance for a gun position that fit under the deck. I can always cut and push more foam away if i need.

Royaloakmin
06-24-2009, 11:41 AM
Lala, you can use plain white glue to glue it. Also, you likely need it only below the waterline, where the curves are. May save another finger:)

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-24-2009, 12:05 PM
Yes I say I glue it with Aleene's (white) glue... works very well. I want to do the upper sides also for the reason that on the model the skin it is the size of the whole ship and it does not overlap or join where the structure is. So you have the ends of the paper just join in the middle of nothing. There are also some complicated areas that I want more support around and so the parts do not fall down inside the hollow shell.

It is not my first ship. I make some progress on the Cruiser Aurora and I have difficulty with the skinning over the hollow areas...

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Bow-1.jpg


http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Front.jpg


And I make this awful missile boat

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/bowseam.jpg

BARX2
06-24-2009, 12:31 PM
The foam is a great idea. I think it would work great for long cylinders, like rocket bodies. I think you're getting cut because you work so fast!

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-24-2009, 12:39 PM
Well I got cut the first time because I hold my ruler down with my hand to make a very long cut... and I draw the knife into my thumb.

Today I cut my finger because I have no handle for the long knife blade. It does not fit into the small handle. And I hold the foam I am cutting into in my hand. It is my fault.

B-Manic
06-24-2009, 01:20 PM
I like the foam idea Lala. The Aurora skins look great to me. Sorry to hear about your injuries. I have a few blood stained models myself.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-24-2009, 01:39 PM
The Aurora it is "okay" (well aside from blotchy Maly Modelarz paper) but to join the three side strips with no forms beneath is difficult, and in some areas the paper it would buckle and warp, and for the stern gallery it start to tear a tiny bit. So I want some structure I can fix the paper to firmly. Like you would not put wall paper over the wooden frame of a wall no? You would use dry wall (foam) and then the wall paper.

BARX2
06-24-2009, 01:54 PM
Well I got cut the first time because I hold my ruler down with my hand to make a very long cut... and I draw the knife into my thumb.

Today I cut my finger because I have no handle for the long knife blade. It does not fit into the small handle. And I hold the foam I am cutting into in my hand. It is my fault.

That's how I usually cut myself. I don't realize my fingers are hanging over the edge of the ruler and - ouch!!

I've cut floral foam with a long butcher knife. You can also get a knife like this very cheap and slide the blade way out to cut large stuff like the foam.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-24-2009, 02:06 PM
You know, I have the break blade sliding knife and I forget about it because I put it away. Mine it is bright orange and it look like a toy to my daughter when she see it.

Greg S.
06-24-2009, 02:57 PM
Florist foam. What a good idea. My wife tried to give a case of it away a few days ago but the charity did not want it. It it sandable? I wonder if there are any health risks?

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-24-2009, 02:58 PM
Yes it is sandable. And you can carve it closely to shape. It has a heavy dust and I work with it outside. So I would advice to use some caution. But then wood dust it is bad...

Papercut
06-24-2009, 06:58 PM
Florist foam. What a good idea. My wife tried to give a case of it away a few days ago but the charity did not want it. It it sandable? I wonder if there are any health risks? Not if you wear a paper mask. Lungs have a hard time w/inhaled forms of styrene:eek:.

mark
06-26-2009, 05:24 PM
Wonderful ideas and thank you! One of my first models was the Modelarz "Krasin." It came out OK and looks good in a display case. However the colors were tired to say nothing of cutting through paper a sardine factory wouldn't take. I will try to find another Krasin and try your techniques

Mark

whulsey
06-26-2009, 07:36 PM
Florist foam, a splendid idea. I'd been looking for something like that especially that's inexpensive.

Golden Bear
06-29-2009, 03:55 PM
Hopefully this was not the build that you referred to "throwing away printed sheets" (something like that). I'm hoping to see more of it.


Carl

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-29-2009, 04:00 PM
I broke the ship in half and throw the print parts for it and others away. Along with the built models I have make.

I look at the wood parts but have no motivation to fix them.

B-Manic
06-29-2009, 04:43 PM
I broke the ship in half and throw the print parts for it and others away. Along with the built models I have make.

I look at the wood parts but have no motivation to fix them.


:eek: ??????????????????? :eek:
?
?
?

Golden Bear
06-29-2009, 04:53 PM
I'm sorry to hear that.:(

elliott
06-29-2009, 07:08 PM
Haven't been here long enough to make your acquaintance or that of all your work b-b-but all of them? From what I've seen of your posts thus far I'm much the poorer. <sad>

Phil
06-29-2009, 08:17 PM
Where's my friggin PROZAC? :(

elliott
06-30-2009, 06:54 AM
What I was trying to say was - if I was not able to see all of her work because some had been destroyed I would be the loser. The intent was to compliment her work.

If I offended anyone by my post I apologize.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-30-2009, 07:25 AM
I am not offend! It is all well. I am sad too, My sister she save the box in the trash but they are mostly broken up and squash. I have the wood parts for the ship but they are broken badly (I step on it in the middle). I have not inclined to make anything since and I do not want to look in the box of broken model.

Tim Crowe
06-30-2009, 09:00 AM
Sad :(

Probably just as well your hobby is card models instead of cat breeding :)

Tim

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-30-2009, 09:14 AM
I am very sad about it today and it does not help that it is raining out side and I have nothing I feel like working at or to look at.

mabrown
06-30-2009, 09:35 AM
I am very sorry to hear about what has happened to your models Lala.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-30-2009, 09:43 AM
Well I make the only parts I have left. I had some scrap card with a draft print in white of the cannon barrels. In the end they will be black.

It is a difficult piece to make, and the first piece I have make that is rolled tightly like this. Each cannon it is one piece but it resemble three piece. The card it is some what hard to roll and I have nothing small like a wire to start the roll. And it is difficult the end of the card it does not align on each segment. So you have three seam edges that are not in a line. I make the first two cannon (front and middle) with the card. I make the third just from typing paper. The paper it can be rolled to be thinner but the definition in the segmentation is less...


http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Guns.jpg

Here is the seam on the bottom of the card stock cannon. The photograph it make it look curved but the cannon it is straight in the real life. But the seam where each segment ends it is not in align and you would have to, on the finish model, to align the cannons in such a way to hide the seam. I make these quickly since they are not the real cannon for the model (which no longer exist anyway)
http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/Guns2.jpg

jagolden01
06-30-2009, 09:46 AM
I am very sad about it today and it does not help that it is raining out side and I have nothing I feel like working at or to look at.

Lala, may I be so bold as to suggest:

the CSS David semi-submersible
Racer No. 5
or the Diamond Tankette here:

TinPaper Moon Tank Model (http://www.tinpaper.net/)

They're rather simple but fun (if I do say so myself :) )

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-30-2009, 09:54 AM
Those are nice. I have seen them before (I think). I want mostly to finish my ship btu I do not feel like to ahve to start over completely and I have not the money this week for the wood again.

Royaloakmin
06-30-2009, 09:56 AM
Lala, the thin paper is good for rolling, and less definition is better for the barrels. Don't wory about the seams, just hide them on the bottom.

Paper Shipright has a very nice free monitor, that does not require reinforcing card.

We all want to encourage you because we can see that you have talent:)

jagolden01
06-30-2009, 10:07 AM
Those are nice. I have seen them before (I think). I want mostly to finish my ship btu I do not feel like to ahve to start over completely and I have not the money this week for the wood again.

It is hard to start a model over. I just fudged a part because I didn't even want to make just the part again.
Despite its fun, modeling can get frustrating - I take breaks for as long as a couple of weeks.

Sorry to hear about your models.

Your presence here is truly a breath of fresh air and your model work is very good. I still can't get over how good your skills are for being at the hobby for so short a time! The Micromodel and other small builds are fascinating.

Hope to see more from you!

The papershipwright site is a good idea. They've got some really nice free ones!

smyfe
06-30-2009, 10:15 AM
Hi, Lala, those guns look gorgeous, and as for the picture of the seam, what seam?:D You have a fine skill in the models you have built and shown here, Keep up the excellent work and keep us all smiling:) with your builds.
Best wishes
Mick

Michael Mash
06-30-2009, 10:44 AM
Lala:
I agree with Fred. Sorry to hear Potemkin is gone. But we all want to see more of your work. Please don't retire.
Mike

cdavenport
06-30-2009, 11:02 AM
My heart goes out to you Lala for I know the pain of losing one's children...models. Recently, I did a really nice job on the Renova CSS Hunley only to have it knocked off the shelf by my two teenage sons who were playing with a beachball--INSIDE THE HOUSE! I was furious!

Like many forum members, I am prior military. After moving around the country and world for 20 years, I have suffered the loss of quite a few models not including those that I stupidly damaged myself.

So, mourn the loss of your loved ones for some time, then pick yourself up and start over again.

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-30-2009, 11:04 AM
I want to just fix or finish the ship but it will be much work to start anew and it is many pages to re-do over.

Perhaps some one they make this battleship, it is the Dvenadtsat Apostolov who she play the Potemkin in the movie Potemkin.

http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/dv12apostles.jpg

ct ertz
06-30-2009, 11:24 AM
I am sure you will keep up with this...it is in you. You almost have to, like an addiction. I know, as do most of us here.

By the way, I am glad that you are still posting. I get a kick out of the way you substitute "dear" for expensive. Being from South Dakota, I grew up hearing the made up word "spendy" instead of expensive.

And of coarse, I like watching your models come together. I really enjoyed your small scale farm machines!

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-30-2009, 11:31 AM
Thank you. I wish I had the tractor. I had like that very much.

I never hear Spendy before.

Golden Bear
06-30-2009, 11:54 AM
I suppose that you know this already, but www.navarin.ru (http://www.navarin.ru) has a free download of the Russian pre-dreadnought Oslyabya. There are also free plans for several ships if you are inclined to attempt your own design.

It isn't Potemkin but the price is right.


Carl

Golden Bear
06-30-2009, 11:58 AM
There are also free high quality aircraft models at www.modele-kartonowe.com (http://www.modele-kartonowe.com). A few of us have built them and I can recommend the quality.


Carl

Royaloakmin
06-30-2009, 01:49 PM
Oddly enough, funny that you mention the Twelve Apostles. I think Orel is working on her now. If you go to their forum, in the "new" subforum, you can check for yourself. I can read the alphabet but I can only make out limited words.

redhorse
06-30-2009, 06:36 PM
Good to see you're making something!! Even if it's only gun barrels right now. It's hard at least for me to stop making things. I haven't trashed a paper model yet, but I've thrown a few plastic ones across the room in the middle of builds. It must be age, it's mellowed me out a bit!

I'm still hoping to see Potemkin built, and it seems you've already done half the job in the recoloring...

Keds_Girl_Lala
06-30-2009, 06:48 PM
When I throw the model down and step on it, I have the hull mostly finish with wood and foam and I have 16 sheets of the printed pages I throw out. I want to start over but it is too much for my lack of motivation. I do not know if it is eaiser to fix the damage or to start over. It is many hours of work.

SJPONeill
06-30-2009, 07:19 PM
Having done similar deconstructions in the past, starting again is normally easier and quicker because you are aware of the perils and pitfalls already...good to see you back...

Zathros
06-30-2009, 07:22 PM
I like the Viking burial method. Seal the hull, light it on fire and set her off. Best done in the evening.

mabrown
06-30-2009, 09:14 PM
I suppose that you know this already, but www.navarin.ru (http://www.navarin.ru) has a free download of the Russian pre-dreadnought Oslyabya. There are also free plans for several ships if you are inclined to attempt your own design.

It isn't Potemkin but the price is right.Carl

I didn't know about this one. Thanks for the heads up Carl.

dto
06-30-2009, 11:05 PM
I suppose that you know this already, but www.navarin.ru (http://www.navarin.ru) has a free download of the Russian pre-dreadnought Oslyabya. There are also free plans for several ships if you are inclined to attempt your own design.

It isn't Potemkin but the price is right.


Carl


Beware! I tried building this model when it first became available a few years ago. I was very disappointed since there were serious problems with the frames.

David Hathaway tried to fix this, but he stopped when Roman Detyna of Digital Navy released his Oslabya (same ship, different phonetic spelling). It's not free, but I highly recommend Roman's kit if you want to build the Oslabya -- both all-white and black Tsushima paint schemes can be built.

Ships (http://www.digitalnavy.com/html/ships.html)

Keds_Girl_Lala
07-01-2009, 11:55 AM
Ok I have make some new parts again but it is very slow. It is hard to cut away some of the glue foam and fixed wood from the parts I have keep from before. http://i417.photobucket.com/albums/pp256/Carla_Lashelle/decking.jpg

This time also I make some parts from card board but it is so soft and mushy... I do not know...

Phil
07-01-2009, 11:58 AM
I'm very proud of you!;)

B-Manic
07-01-2009, 12:01 PM
I'm glad to see you are back on track with this build Lala. The last one looked so good.

Golden Bear
07-01-2009, 12:31 PM
Woo hoo!! I bet it comes out much better than you could ever have hoped!


Carl

redhorse
07-01-2009, 06:38 PM
Excellent! Glad you started back!

Keds_Girl_Lala
07-01-2009, 07:33 PM
I will probably get some work to the point I had stopped... and then maybe put it away a little and make some thing I feel moer like making for right now. And then finish when I feel better again.