Limber and Caisson.

[silveroxide]

Another unique piece of artillery was the caisson. We usually see the cannon and the limber combination but rarely do we see the caisson. With this build, I intend to rectify that absence.

I started to re construct the limber from my original earlier build and it surprised me that it went faster than I expected. The wheels were done with the jig from the Horse drawn coaches and buggy build thread so I will not repeated here. I used the larger rear wheel jig for the wheels of this project.

And now we begin another in the series:

The wheels are thicker and wider than those of the buggy. The axle timber was laminated thickly to a square thickness. I drilled a hole at both ends of the timber when the glue set and kept the clamps in place to avoid the ends from splitting out.

For the axle rods, I used a paper rod from an ear swab, and then Fit Tested the wheels to the axles.

The last picture is the one of the schematics that I am using as a reference.:):):)

[rmks2000]

You've got wheel construction down to a science!

[Retired_for_now]

Consistently amazing! I remain in awe of the skill (eye sight, steady hands, fine motor control, &etc.) displayed in each of you builds.

Yogi

[Paperwarrior]

This is looking good!
The caisson is a great subject. As you said, everyone thinks of the cannon and limber but that is only half the section. The full section also includes another limber pulling a caisson this gave them another 3 chests of ammo and a spare wheel.
As an artilleryman I tip my hat and thank you.

[B-Manic]

Lookin mighty fine Pedro ~ beautiful. Its all coming together. I don't have to tell you I'm looking forward to seeing the whole gun train come together.

[silveroxide]

Thanks for all of your comments guys.

Here is the framework for the Limber ammo chassis. Underneath the foot boards there is a wedge to angle the large foot board. The two outside ammo box supports have a slight angle at the rear. The front Splinter bar also has a taper. It is flat on top and slightly angle on the bottom leading to the outside.

Next installment will be the ammo box.:):):):)

[Don Boose]

This is great! I've been expecting this one to come along and, once again, it's a pleasure to see you at work. As my Redlegged friend said, the caisson is essential.

And the images with explanatory notes are worth the price of admission.

Don
Grandson of Pvt Edward Oliver Henry Boose, Battery E, 1st Pennsylvania Volunteer Light Artillery, 1861-1865.

[Miles Linnabery]

Dear Silver:
As a reenactor of Light Artillery 4th Art Battery B you need to also do the travaling forge also based on the same wheels and limber underpinnings I might be able to fing some drawings kicking around in the basement. from research I helped with when the group started to build one at 1:1 scale.
Miles Linnabery

[silveroxide]

Don Boose. You are more than welcome and thanks for the comment

Miles Linnabery I do have some pictures of the forge but I can use any more info that you may have, and any on the Caisson itself also. thanks

[silveroxide]

The remake of my limber is coming along much better than my original one. I am going to have to start to paint the Limber soon because the metal straps and hinges are coming up soon and they will make it harder to paint on the finished build. Here are some more updates.

The box is going to be laminated around the basic box. The first lamination will be to install the inside lip for the tray stop. After the inside is done, I place another lamination around the outside of the box.

The horse teams are supposed to be of six horses but many were pulled by four as well. I opted for the four due the length and size of the full display with the caisson attached.

I have to start to work on the small parts now and update the plans before I put them in the downloads.:):):)

[cgutzmer]

love your work! its interesting and informative to watch your process!
Chris

[silveroxide]

Thanks for the comments Chris.

Here are a few more updates. Finished with the limber frame and started painting the parts. I made a mistake in that I wanted to make the model into a Confederate gray and I grabbed the Yankee Green instead. This means that the rest of the build will be a Union Artillery piece instead.

The metal parts for the limber are supposed to be painted black but I decided to go for the dark metal look instead. It gives it a better contrast as long as it does not rust. There are a few more small stuff like metal bands and straps to be made as well as some chain work and attachment rings. Again, it has surprised me as to how well it is going up till now. See you all in the next posting, more to come.:):):)

[Don Boose]

Outstanding, as always. I really like to see the way you design and put these gems together. And the instructional commentary and notes on the images lulls me into thinking that someday I will actually be able to build one (Yankee green is okay with me). Don

[silveroxide]

Thanks for the comment Don.

As I make the model, it seems logical the step by step method but some might say, "How did he do that?". I used my old background of scratch building back in the days of plastic and styrene sheets. I still use what is available and I try to keep my models at least 80% to 90% paper. In this build section I go back to what works. I was going to do the rivets/bolts out of paper but I opted to use cut off heads from straight pins. This will saturate the model at those points that a bolt is needed, to include the ammo box and the Caisson later on.

Here are a few more updates. Added the outer metal bands around the wheels.

I made a divider for the rounds in the ammo box and started to place the bolts.

Started to place the straps at the connecting points.

I used my dremmel with a Cut off pin pre-drill the initial holes where I will place the pin heads acting as bolts.

[redhorse]

You do such beautiful work, I'm always amazed when I see your stuff.

[30-06]

Another Outsanding Build! What company manufactures the horses? I will follow this build with great interest - I showed your Stagecoach and Dr. Buggy to my 82 YO Mother - She is really excited to see your future work. Her father ran a frieght wagon here in Idaho around 1900 - 1911. Thank You for sharing your creativity and skill.
Gregor

[silveroxide]

Redhorse: Thanks for the comment. more stuff to come. This is a three stage build. After I am done with the Limber, I will start on the caisson, after that is the harness set up for the horse team.

30-06: Thanks for the comment. The horses are from Walmart in the toys section. They go for $1.00 and come in different poses. Salutations to your Grandmother and I am glad that I can make her re-call a more carefree time. My grandmother passed away six years ago. She was born in 1897 and lived through some interesting times in modern history. From horse drawn to space, a lot has happened in between. Long life and happiness to your grandmother and the sharpness of mind to the end.

Here are a few more updates on the Limber.

Placed the bolts in place and worked a different way for the hinges. Since the hinges are too small I decided to make a field expedient version using Thread (rope)instead.

Did the pintle or tow hook and attached it as well as the bolts, and attached the Ammo Box to the Frame.

More to come, stand by for more:):):):).

[silveroxide]

More updates, I am going to have to slow down some and start to put some of these details in the plans. I seem to be getting ahead of myself. The Limber is almost finished with the exception to the Yoke and the tip of the pole. Should get started on the caisson soon.

Constructed the Pole prop and the retainer strap. The pole prop has a chain and pin to hold it up. In this case, I used a strap which can be slid on and off to activate the pole prop.

Made two bucket holders out of paper clip scrap and attached them to the rear of the Axles below the hounds.

Next on the list are the D-rings with the O-rings for attaching to the Trace.

Made some washers and a pin to hold the wheels in place. I drilled a small hole in the axle ends and made the pins from a straight pin. They are not bent to stay in place for now since I need to take the wheels off later to make the Handles. This stage is almost done.:):):):)

[Paperwarrior]

Silveroxide,

This is an amazing build! You've done a magnificent job. The details you've put into it are nothing short of amazing. :eek: I really enjoyed your ammo chest build. I'm ready to load it up with rounds! :D

I'm sure I'm a bit late with some of these photos, but I hope they help. One of the "Other things we do" is I volunteer at a museum doing muzzle loading cannon demonstrations. Typically, I'm the ammo guy....seems I've done that most of my career:rolleyes:...anyway...

I've attached some photos of real limbers and the ammo inside. Typically, the lid was covered on top with a layer of copper. This helped with preventing detonation by static electricity. Since weather was always an issue a canvas tarp was carried. This was carried atop the ammo chest and tied down with leather straps. This was also a nice cushion to sit on rather than the hard lid. :D

I hope these help.

[silveroxide]

Thanks for the reference photos Paperwarrior. Looking at the photos, The light bulb clicked and The next two ammo boxes on the caisson will have a different style of hinges that closely resemble the originals. I have some photos of the ammo in the box but the tray is different. It is shallower, filled with sawdust and the tools and implements were placed here. The boxes on the caisson will be slightly different. Taking a short rest and build will continue soon.

[Don Boose]

I love those photos of the Napoleon Model 1857 12-pounder gun-howitzer in action, Paperwarrior. Those were my grandfather's guns.

And I love seeing the interaction that resulted in further refinements to silveroxide's already superb model. Synergy among papermodelers, just as described in Joint Pub 3-0.

Army Strong!

[silveroxide]

About those photos, I noticed a glitch in the model. I re-checked my references and they also made it clear that the Straps on the ammo box are off. They should align with the Hounds (Outer Support arms) Also, the latch is to the rear and I have it to the front. It is too late to remedy that unless I do the ammo chest over again. I may try to recover when I do the other Chest and attempt to lift he chest and replace it with one from the Caisson. As I said previously, I went too far ahead of myself and was not paying attention. But hopefully it is recoverable.

[Paperwarrior]

Don, you slay me! :D :D :D I had to read you comment to the guys in my office. We all got a kick out of it. That is one of the great things about this forum...the Synergy.

Silveroxide, I hope the picks helped. Your model is awesome and I cannot wiat to see more!!

If you like this limber...the museum where I volunteer also demonstrates with a Model 1841 Mountain Howitzer. Now that is an interesting limber. It actually has two, thin ammo chests. Since the 12 pound round is so big in diameter (relatively speaking) you, obviously cannot get very many in the box. Sorry, but I cannot seem to find my picture of it. :( I know I have one. :confused: Oh well, I'll send it as soon as I can find it. Many very interesting artillery and carriage designs during the American Civil War period.

Thank you for bringing it to life for us!

[silveroxide]

Paperwarrior: I believe that I have some schematics for the mountain gun. It looks almost like a 12 pounder. It was used more in the Western campaigns against the Indians if recall. But send me what referencesyou have, I can never have enough reference materials.

Here are a few updates on the Limber. I re-did the hinges and re-colored the top of the box a bronze color. I also noticed the the opening of the box could be from the front or the rear so it will stay as is. The only error will be in the box bands in that they do not align with the hounds.

For the hinges, I wrapped a strip of cardstock around a bent pin. I then embedded the bent pin into the thick side of the box. I am glad that I laminated the sides heavy. It allows for the pins to be set secure. And now for the front yoke section and then on to the Caisson.:):):)

[silveroxide]

Got around to making those handles out of soft metal. I remembered that I have a small hand vise anvil and I used that to form the flat edges to the handles. My drill bits are a little dull and I could not drill the holes so I cut a small slit into the box and bent the tip of the flat edge and inserted it into the box. I used Gorilla super glue to hold and glue the piece in place. The small slit is small enough to hold the piece in place and so the handles are done. Now to work on that front yoke so that this stage will be over and I can start on that Caisson. That horse harness is still waiting for me as well and that will be time consuming. See you all shortly with more updates.:):):)

[Retired_for_now]

If obsession it is, it is a magnificent one.

Don, I'm still waiting for the interagency doctrine before I call synergy.

Yogi

[silveroxide]

Thanks for the comment Yogi.

Well the first stage is at an end. Now to go to phase 2, and start on that caisson. in the meantime, here are the final build pics of the limber. I should have placed my ruler next to the build so as to get a size comparison but I used one of my collectible Star Wars figures for a size comparison.

The final part is the yoke. Fir this I used a metal piece and bent it into that bow.

I made some ring attachments and with a thin paper strip, made the belt that holds the ring in place. There is a boot cover that goes to the front and a Belt that also goes at the front but these items are stowed when the teams are attached, so they are not reflected here.

Next postings will be in the construction of the Caisson. See you all around the forums.:):):)

[Paperwarrior]

This limber looks great!
I'm looking forward to your Caisson!
I get some photos and such for the Model 1841 Moutain Howitzer and Limber for you. Oh, and yes, it was a 12 pounder.

[silveroxide]

Thanks paperwarrior.

So here is phase II of the build, the Caissson. Again I am surprised as to how well it is going together again. The hardest part would have been the wheels but I did all of the wheels at one time so they are ready on the side.

This lamination technique is almost like making paper into wood again. The build is straight forward at this time. The devil is in the details, which will come soon enough.:):):)

[Sammuel]

This is great work and I have been following your build. Hope someday that I could match your skills. Outstanding.

Sam

[silveroxide]

Thank you for the comment Sammuel:

This is an instructional thread. Hopefully someone else will attempt to build this model as well.

The first two schematics are what I used for the build. For other details I used a series of photos of real caissons for references. It is straight forward and easy to follow. The only thing, is that everything is laminated heavily. As with the limber, I used cut heads from straight pins for bolts. More details to come.:):):)

[Sammuel]

Silveroxide;

Great work!

I tried downloading your gattlin gun from the download section but I was unable to read the programe you have it on. Is it possable to get it in PDF. I really would like to work on that build.

Keep up the great work and I'm learning so much from your builds.

Sam

[silveroxide]

Silveroxide;

Great work!

I tried downloading your gattlin gun from the download section but I was unable to read the programe you have it on. Is it possable to get it in PDF. I really would like to work on that build.

Keep up the great work and I'm learning so much from your builds.

Sam

It is a RAR folder. You will need to get a a win=zip or rar program to be able to open it.

Be advise, that there are some quirks to this model. You will have to refer to the build thread. I have a technique to frustrate pirates. I do not put the instructions with my models. This is one of the reasons that I do a build thread. If I should decide to upload a model, then the instructions are the build thread and it will force the pirate to find the build thread and download each and everyone of the build process. The Gatling Gun is approximately a 1/25 scale model. Not too small but not too large either, but you can adjust the size by cut and pasting. Have fun but do not get frustrated. See you around in the forums.:):):)

[silveroxide]

The main body of the Limber is about done. The next step will be the Ammo Boxes. They are done the same way as in the Limber portion of this thread. There will be a variation in that the Caisson limbers will be partition for ammo only and will not have the tray section.

As in the limber section, made the washer and retainer pins for the wheels.

Did the brackets for the extra limber pole. The rear bracket is from a paper clip bent into position and the front bracket from heavy card stock painted metal gray. The Pole itself was kept naked dark wood. The boxes will be next and some other small items like pails/buckets.:):):)

[B-Manic]

That is one beautiful design and build Pedro. Can we look forward to a picture of the whole gun train at some point in the future?

[silveroxide]

That is one beautiful design and build Pedro. Can we look forward to a picture of the whole gun train at some point in the future?


This is a series in progress. The caisson chassis will be made into the forge, the goods wagon and a special one on a burial caisson. The Artillery will also follow with a 12 pounder, a rifle and a breech gun. There is more to come to include the horse harness.:):):)

[Paperwarrior]

Silveroxide,
On 4 May we are putting on a demonstration for some Army Trainees and the Director of Museums for TRADOC. At that time we'll pull out the Mountain Howitzer and its Limber. At that time I'll take some reference photos for you and get some deminsions, if I can remember my tape measure.

[silveroxide]

Just get the pictures, I have a good eye for dimensions. Thanks and have fun. See you around in the forums.

[silveroxide]

More updates on the caisson. If it was not for the details, this phase would have been finished.

Started on the Ammo Boxes. They are heavily laminated and also have the inside lip that goes all around the inside of the box. Test fitted them on the Caisson to make sure there was enough clearance from the spare wheel. Painted the inside of the box and then made the partitions which come even with the inner lip. Painted the partitions and as you can see, it leaves the option of placing a full upper tray or two half trays into the box. More details to come. See you all around in the forums.:):):):)

[silveroxide]

Update on those ammo boxes. Cut and folded the corner brackets and the bands

On the lid, I placed a raised section in the center to give the lid its curvature. The bottom part is to be flat. to avoid the bottom from curving up, I used a flat surface (the Ruler) and forced the top to curve down to the ruler.

The hinge was done by taking a strip and folding it on itself with a formed straight pin to act as the hinge. The open end of the pin was then forced down into the thicker wall of the box. This is one of the main reasons for heavy lamination. Finally the top cover strap is in place. The caisson is almost done but more details to follow.:):):)

[Don Boose]

It's all wonderful. I sure hope you will be able to join us for Army Heritage Day, 15-16 May, here in Carlisle. The folks at AHEC are excited at the possibility of seeing your horse-drawn vehicles and artillery. We talked about this at the opening of the new Omar Bradley exhibit on Friday.

Don

[silveroxide]

Thanks for the offer Don. I should know by next Friday if there any contracts coming up and should let you know then. See you around in the forums.

[silveroxide]

Now to do some riveting on those boxes. It takes about 50 pins to make those rivets.. See you all next posting after I finish cutting and placing all of those rivets.:):):)

[kenlwest]

Another amazing build!

Ken

[silveroxide]

Thank you for the comment Ken;

Well for all practical purposes, the Caisson is done. The boxes are functional in that they open and close and the Hasp does work on the Caisson boxes. I did not do the hasp that way on the limber. It is a bit too late to rectify that.

After all of those small rivets, my eyesight is still trying to re-adjust. I may have to buy me one of those lamp style magnifiers for the small work.

I will continue on with phase three shortly. There are a myriad of small details still to be made like buckets, the ammo and small instruments for the boxes, but I will continue on with the horse harness first. I have to figure a way to make those McClellan Saddles. I have enough info to get started. There is one thing that I have noticed, is that there are no reins for the team. The Near Riders control the movement of the unit. Hopefully paperwarrior can instruct me on the movement control of the unit. I will take a short break and start again on the horses. See you all around in the forums.:):):)

[Don Boose]

This is really superb! I can't wait to see what the next project will be.

Don

[silveroxide]

This is really superb! I can't wait to see what the next project will be.

Don


Right now I am taking in a short break and doing some more research for other carriages, but next on line is the horse team with harness. Also, I am going to re do the base on the buggy. The paper base tended to curl slightly up at the ends. I may have to do the bases for the carriages, limbers and caisson out wood to avoid this.:confused:

[Paperbeam]

Outstanding work, silveroxide!

Each one of your builds is yet another little beauty to behold.

Terry

[silveroxide]

Thanks for the comment Paperbeam, If just one person likes and enjoy my works, then it was worth it to accomplish it.


Here are some final pics of the wheel section and the team that will pull it. The horses were painted matte black and some more painting details to come. After the horses are ready, the harnessing will begin. Here I placed the whole team in line and there is a ruler to measure the size of it. As you can see, if I were to have built it at 1/16 scale, it would have been a full desk ornament. Room is at a premium and at this size it is still large display.

[silveroxide]

First thing was designing the collar, but before I start to harness the team, I need to place the blankets on them. They came from scrap felt and cut to size. Drew the lines and the U.S. markings on them.

The collars are a bit too large but there is one that is trimmed to size. The rest of the collars will follow suit.:):):)

[silveroxide]

One of the main problems, is in making the saddle. I came up with a pattern for making the saddle. It is in the beta format right now but as soon as it is finished I will post as to how I made it with the other three horses. It came out good but patience, pics will follow.

[silveroxide]

Here is a teaser on the saddle. Once this is accomplished, the rest of the harness is will be easier to attach to the saddle. Made the collar and placed the cushion under it. Made the blankets and cushion Artillery Red. More to come.:):):)

[silveroxide]

I know that my horse is not the standard paper one but I want to make it as close to a mini real as possible. The saddle took some time to make but now I know what to expect. Also the harness is a feat in itself. I ran out of chain so off to the dollar store to pick up some cheap chains. Some of the buckles and small fittings were omitted due to their minuscule size, but over all it came out presentable. Now I have three others to do and I will do the thread build on the harness and tack. By the way, the horse on its side does not mean it met a bad end, it is for viewing purposes so that I do not have to move my camera from its tripod for an overhead shot. I am bit lazy I guess. Enjoy and see you all around in the forums.:):):)

[silveroxide]

So here is the start of that saddle. Made an oval shape template for the seat. Double it on itself and punched two holes to make the tell tale center split of a McClellan. With the round end made with the punch hole, cut the center excess off. For the front and back of the seat, I laminated thickly and trimmed off the excess to make a concave at the bottom. With my dremmel I sanded off at an angle to creat the angled back and front of the seat. More on the strip or belts for the rest of the tack to come.:):)

[silveroxide]

More updates on the saddle and harness. The saddles are done, now to work on the rest of the harness.

Making the D-rings for the Stirrups, using a clamp and bending the scrap straight pins used during the riveting of the Ammo Boxes. Folded the strip on the flat end of the D-rings and attached them to the bottom of the saddle.

Cut a bunch of thin strips to use as belts and straps. Used a thin strip to make the cradle of the saddle and crossing them at the bottom. Attached them together with an O-ring.

Attached the Stirrup strap to the saddle rings. Almost done, I just have to get more chains for the harness.:):):)

[birder]

Silveroxide just catching up on this project, wow is all I can say as with the other horse age projects you have done. Really cool and historically significant work which we can learn from. This is also cool as no-one I see is working in this arena (horse word).

[silveroxide]

Silveroxide just catching up on this project, wow is all I can say as with the other horse age projects you have done. Really cool and historically significant work which we can learn from. This is also cool as no-one I see is working in this arena (horse word).


Obi is doing the Chuck Wagon, which is on my future build projects. I regret that the horse are store bought but it would take forever to make four of them but the harness procedures are a build all its own regardless of the horses.

I may make the horses out of paper later if I do a single horse carriage. This is a three stage build thread. Thanks for the comments and there is still more to come. :):):)

[silveroxide]

More updates on the saddles and harness.

Used two O-Rings to make the cinch connectors for the cinch. Then attached it to the saddle through the other O-Ring connector (Y-connector).

Using the needle nose I formed the foot stirrups by laminating them and final step I attached them to the stirrup belt/strap. Don't worry about the finger marks on the white build. It will be taken care off when the harness is painted later in the build.

Started on the belly strap/cinch. More to come in the next posting.:):):)

[Don Boose]

Amazing work. I certainly enjoy looking at the step-by-step photos. Not only do you have the skill to build these remarkable models, but also the flash of insight to see how to craft the parts out of paper (given my profession, and the military nature of many of your model, I naturally think of the flash of genius -- the coup d'oeil -- that Clausewitz speaks of).

Don

[silveroxide]

Thanks for the comments Don. If you were to take all of Von Clausewitz wisdom and translated into plain English, it would come out as using your common sense. When you use the KISS principle, you have a tendency to have success versus something complicated multiplied by how many men in your section, trying to understand the process. :(:confused::rolleyes::eek:

More on the harness and saddle. As you can see, the straps can be locked in place, they are operational. Sorry for the blurry one, i bumped the tripod. The last pic is one of the horses finished and ready to be hitched to the limber. There are two different harnesses for the team. This one is the near team, the one closest to the limber. The front harness is slightly different but that is still to come. See you all later....:):):)

[Paperwarrior]

You've done a great job with the Artillery Model of the McClellan saddle. There are many times I have to explain, even to artillerymen, that the D ring on the front and back of the saddle indicates that it is the Artillery Model as the saddle actually becomes part of the harness. Ditto to what Don said, you've done an amazing job on this. And for those who don't know...the McClellan Saddle is really comfortable. While growing up this was my saddle of choice.

I should have those Mountain Howitzer and Limber photos for you Tuesday.

[silveroxide]

[QUOTE=Paperwarrior;119414]You've done a great job with the Artillery Model of the McClellan saddle. There are many times I have to explain, even to artillerymen, that the D ring on the front and back of the saddle indicates that it is the Artillery Model as the saddle actually becomes part of the harness. Ditto to what Don said, you've done an amazing job on this. And for those who don't know...the McClellan Saddle is really comfortable. While growing up this was my saddle of choice.


I have not gotten to that part yet but here are some updates that will show what paperwarrior meant. This saddle does not have the skirting/leg guards attached. I left them out on purpose to differentiate between the Cavalry and the Artillery saddle as well.

Here I placed the square pad that goes behind the O-ring (Y connector) Next I placed the front and back connectors. This supposed to be on a short strap with the D-connector. I drilled a hole to the front and back and placed the ring (straight pin with a loop ) into the front and back.

The cinch and girth straps are operational, I looped the straps through the O-rings and locked them in place.

I used a heavy thread for the crupper and attached it to the rear of the saddle with a strap though the rings. After the glue dried, I made a keeper for the crupper to hold the loop closer to the tail.

There we have the three Horses A** with the cruppers in place. I found a chain that was smaller than the one I originally used and replaced them with a smaller gauge. These are more in size than the big lunky ones I originally used.

I hope to have this thread finished before 14 May, but I still have to work on the bridles as well. As mentioned before, Sorry about the store bought horses but the tack and gear make up for it as a separate build. More to come.:):):)

[Don Boose]

Those are some high spirited horse artillery mounts. I can hear the bugles and the sounds of the hooves and wheels as that caisson rolls.

[Miles Linnabery]

Dear SilverOxide:
The Civil War artillery unit I was part of used Grimsly Saddles not the Mclean style. I liked the 12in Mclean myself. though the grimsly had more padding.
Miles Linnabery
Just ignore me because Lt Artillery after Civil War went to the Mclean in the 70's

[silveroxide]

They are off in the horizon Don, and hopefully you will get to see them soon at the Army Heritage day.

Miles Linnabery: I am glad I named this thread Limber and Caisson, Because if I had said it was a War Between the States model, I would have been off. I looked at my reference pictures and by "Oskosh by Gosh" I am staring at a Grimsley. I have only one reference pic with the Mclelan and it was after the War was over. Any way, If I should do the Artillery piece with limber, I will rectify this and attempt to use the Grimsley with the valise leg guard. I have a bunch of pictures I have to doctor up before posting and they will be up soon. See you all around in the forums.

[Darwin]

Ag2O3, don't get rid of the patterns/instructions for the Mclelan saddle....it would be nice to have them as an option in the kit should one want to do up a post-civil war diorama.

[silveroxide]

Ag2O3, don't get rid of the patterns/instructions for the Mclelan saddle....it would be nice to have them as an option in the kit should one want to do up a post-civil war diorama.


NEVER! Those are already in the files for posterity or when needed, In hard copy, in the computer file and on CD, the triple threat.:):):)

[silveroxide]

More updates. This time it is the collar. Laminated the front part of the collar. This to simulate the slight bulge where the hames straps will go on later. For the strap or hames collar connection I used a thick thread made from hemp found in the arts and craft jewelry section.

Once the hemp thread is in place, I built up the rear of the collar bulge. Once the rear bulge is set, I trimmed off the excess to make a narrower collar. Test fitted them on the horse. This build phase of the limber and caisson seems longer than the limber and caisson and I still have not got to the trace, Bridle and halter yet.:eek:

[silveroxide]

Working on the harness gear. made the square ring for the hames strap/belt.

Here is the flap for the tug rings on the near team and the hames harness tug strap.

Placed the center Strap with ring. and finally the rear saddle connector strap. This is it for now, see you all later.:):):)

[silveroxide]

More on the collar and the harness. Painted the collars and attached it to the horse. Constructed the hames and tug straps. The last photo with three wheel horse harness is two too many. The lead horse have a different harness. That will come in the next posting.:):):)

[silveroxide]

Finishing off the near team and working on the lead. The near horses are almost ready, but I will wait for the halters before I hitch them up to the limber.:):):)

[silveroxide]

More on that harness. This part is on making the metal parts. The connectors in this case are shaped into a T and a U. The T goes to the belts connection to the Hames and the U goes to the limber connection. More to come.:):):)

[silveroxide]

Here are a few updates. The halter and a few details will have to wait while I take off for a few days. In the mean time, enjoy. The first has a ruler in front of it to give you an idea of the size. This is the reason that I went to a four team instead of the full six team.

This is a test fit and It is still lacking the bridles and halters as well as the tie straps to the limber and to each front leads.

[birder]

Continuing to be a wonderful project, I like the realistic style horses, too.:):) Really cool creative stuff here!

[silveroxide]

Continuing to be a wonderful project, I like the realistic style horses, too.:):) Really cool creative stuff here!


Thanks for the comment Birder. I had to stop for a while due to a contract in Georgia, but I hope to be back soon with more on the harness. See you all around in the forums.:):):)

[looker]

Ongoing brilliant modelling. Do you know the minimum number of riders needed to control a team harnessed that way?

[silveroxide]

Usually you have a team of four. Two are riding on the limber and two riders on the left horses (near team). The right side team are riderless (off team). The commander usually rides his own steed.

[Paperwarrior]

This is a great build. I cannot believe how accurate you are with this. I told the folks at the museum where I volunteer that you were building a model of this. They gave the, "That's nice" comments. Then I told them it was paper and I had to help scoop their jaws up. Very nicely done.

Good comments on the crew and riding the horses. It was an easy way to transport the crew (on the horses) and you didn't need a long set of reins and a driver...the riders took care of that.

[gittz]

can u download this model

[rickstef]

can u download this model

You will be able to do so, once it has been released

and Silveroxide has mentioned that in this thread.

Rick

[Miles Linnabery]

Dear Silveroxide:
Will you make a military Casket and Flag in the same scale? this is the casson and limber used for military barials I belive just take off the Back wheel and Ammo boxes. Use just 4 horse hitch 6 horse hitch was war use only between wars 4 was enough.
Its funny what historical info sticks in ones mind.
Miles Linnabery

[Darwin]

Ag2O3, I'm so looking forward to the release of this model. I just got in the Lindberg plastic kit of Union Civil War horse-drawn cannon. So far as detail is concerned, I think your paper one wins.

[silveroxide]

Thanks for all of your comments guys. I do have the templates for the limber in pencil and as soon as I get done with my contracts, I should be fixing them in my paintshop program. They will be the templates only and in white. I like to hand paint my models. You will have to check frequently with this build thread. When I post a download, I do not attach the instructions with it on purpose. I like to keep them separate in case some one should decide to borrow my designs for their own gain. This technique forces the pirate to download each and every photo and written instructions. As you can see, there are over 100 photos and written instructions involved. If he wants it that bad, he has to work for it. Anyone else who downloads the plans from a pirate site, is forced to look for this site and follow the instructions.

This has happened to my Gatling Gun. I was informed that my Gatling was on a pirate site and when I looked it up, I had to smile.... NO INSTRUCTIONS... If you have downloaded my Gatling, you will noticed that it is detailed and not to user friendly unless you have the instructions and know the different paper weights used as well as my paper rolling techniques.

YES, the burial caisson will be in the works and it is a bit simpler to do than the munitions caisson, but then again.... I tend to make things complicated sometimes.

DARWIN, when you build the plastic one, just do some research or check on some of my details and you can enhance the plastic one to the extreme as well.

[Darwin]

To tell you true, I was planning on taking the horses, crew and cannon from the plastic kit and using your caisson, limber, and tack. Might make an interesting hybrid. So when are you going to to a portable forge?

[silveroxide]

I am going to do the easy one first, which will be the forage wagon and the burial caisson which is easier. As for the forge, I got an idea on how to build that anvil and the vise. The forge will be third up on my list. I will be back in business on the 27th of May and will have the time available to work on my build projects.

[Don Boose]

Sounds like you have a worthwhile and interesting series of projects lined up!

Don

[silveroxide]

Sounds like you have a worthwhile and interesting series of projects lined up!

Don


One thing about the horse drawn vehicles, There is an untouched territory here in paper modeling, not to mention the the early artillery pieces, both Naval and Ground forces.:):)

[Paperwarrior]

First off my apologies for taking so long to post these pictures. No excuses. :(

When I took these pictures we were loading up to go put on a demo for the Museum Director for all Training and Doctrine Command museums and about 100 Basic Trainees. It was during the week so we didn't have enough crewmen to man the Mountain Howitzer. Therefore, the pictures are from inside the store house.

The first 3 photos show the limber. It has 2 Ammunition Chests as shown in the next two photos. As you can see they do not carry very many of the 12-pounder rounds (8 ea).

The latch pictures are simply to show how the chests are mounted to the carriage.

[Paperwarrior]

The M1841 Mountain Howitzer is a gun made for moving by horse/mule back, also. Although, in the normal mountain howitzer configuration it had a different carriage than the Prarie carriage.

Anyway.... Here are some photos of the pack saddle and the Howitzer.

[Paperwarrior]

Just a few extras.

A cut away of a 6-pound round.

A cannister shot

And finally, a challenge for a new gun. The mule gun. Yes, this was really built, and yes it was actually tested. The report goes that when the gun was fired the mule went ass over tea kettle down into a near by ditch. Things that make you go hmmmmm. :rolleyes:

[silveroxide]

I remember this setup a long time ago when some of our guys were to train the the Mujaheddins. We did not have any standing SOP on how to load a mule pack and had to scrounge for the old Blue Book. Some of the info Came from Fort Riley, Fort Carson and Fort Hood Texas. The First Cav at the time had a regulation Calvary unit.

In the years gone, I have misplaced that book and it would have come in handy for some of the work that I am presently doing. That is a split limber Ammo box which I have not seen before and the whole carriage looks like it is design for a quick take down to be placed on the pack mules.

As for the mule cannon, I can see that poor animal doing one hell of a back flip somersault. I can envision the Olympic Committee holding up a #10 score.

And BTW, Thanks for the photos. They will come in handy in the future.

[Retired_for_now]

You guys have the neatest toys ...

Though I'd put your limber and caisson build in the ranks of miniaturized equipment rather than a "model" (not a small replica of the real item, seems more like a tiny real piece of equipment).

Yogi

[silveroxide]

Thank you for your comment Yogi.

Well I guess it is time to come back to my horses and finish off the harness thread. This time the build will be on the Bridle and the reins.

Using black card stock the leather works were constructed. Since the models were solid, it was difficult to make the mouth bit all the way through the mouth. The metal bits were made from brass paperclips as well as the rings. Since the main parts are done, the next phase will be the small details, like stowage boxes, pails, ammo for the limbers and other such sundries. See you all around the forums.:):):)

[mbauer]

Great build! Excellent details!

Visited the museum at Ft Lewis last year and they had this one tucked away inside a canopy.

Best regards,
Mike Bauer

[silveroxide]

I have reference material on the limber and cannon from the 1918 era but this is the first on the WW-I caisson. Interesting, I may have to google some more info on it. Thanks.

[B-Manic]

Good to see you back at this one Ag2O.

[silveroxide]

Good to see you back at this one Ag2O.


I needed a break from the stables and went off on a Warhammer 40k tangent. But I am back in the saddle again.:):):)

[Don Boose]

Welcome back. I led the Antietam Staff Ride two weeks ago, including the artillery park at the Visitor's Center. Friday morning, I will be standing on McPherson's Ridge next to the 3-inch Ordnance Rifles of Cutler's Battery (A/2nd U.S.), pontificating on the Battle of Gettysburg.

Looking forward to seeing the completed horses and accoutrements.

Don

[Paperwarrior]

Glad to see you back at this.

This past Saturday we put on another series of Cannon Demonstrations for the public. It was a prelude to the annual Indian Scouts vs. Cannon Balls 1890s era base ball game. Whew, that was fun to watch! The rules and equipment are quite a bit different than what we know of today.

Let me know if you get a bug on the WWI limbers and artillery. We have a few here. I believe we have a Battery Wagon, too.

Jeff

[Don Boose]

I forgot to mention that (1) I appreciated the Silveroxide back story on how you came by your harnessing expertise and (2) I was thinking of your demo team, Jeff, at Antietam, as we had a demonstration firing of a Model 1857 12-pounder (Napoleon) gun-howitzer (the weapon that equipped my grandfather's Battery E, 1st Pennsylvania Volunteer Light Artillery during the American Civil War).

Don

[silveroxide]

Hey Don and Paperwarrior, I am in the process of doing the small stuff. I would like to get some info on the placement of insignias on the cassion and the limber. In the meantime I did the kit bags and attempted some insignias on the bags. Here is the sequence of steps on the kit bags. They are not on the saddle yet but they will be strapped down. One thing that I added to the bag, was a top handle which I did not see in my reference material but it looks logical to keep the bag on the saddle by placing the straps trough the loop. More small stuff to come, see you all around the forums or next posting.:):):)

[birder]

Excellent detail work (have you ever built a sailing ship? I'd like to see her if you have:))

[silveroxide]

Excellent detail work (have you ever built a sailing ship? I'd like to see her if you have:))


Yes I have but wooden ships and wooden scratch built, plank on plank. Inter-coastal smuggler ship with two mast. rear tiller. I do not have pictures of it since I gave them away as Christmas or birthday presents to family members. The first three Were all wood but the last one, I used card stock as the first skin and glued the planking on the card stock. I cut the planking strips individually out of thin bass wood and the deck was made from wooden coffee stirrers. The hardest part was making the brass fittings and I went through a bunch of drill bits. The rigging was made from Upholstery thread which is very strong and not fussy and does not need glue to fix the strength. I may attempt it again as a mixed media, paper lends itself to a lot of the details needed for the decking and other details.

A lot of the techniques learned from paper can be transferred over to ship building. See you all around the forums.:):):)

[silveroxide]

More on the small stuff.

Made the belts from black Cardstock and strapped the valise/kit bag down to the saddle. As mentioned earlier, I took some liberty with the valise and placed a top handle on it. This will ensure that the valise/kit bag stays in place and will not slide out to the side. Some of the valises have handles on the sides instead of the top,

Next installment will be on the canteens. Even Yankees have to drink water, especially in the heat of July around little round top. For lack of water, the Confederates could not take their objective and were push back by Chamberlain's famous wheel movement and bayonet attack. The Rebels had sent out a detail with their water canteens and they were captured. After marching into Gettysburg and attacking, they were parched with thirst and could not carry on the fight. The temperature was in the 100's and heat exhaustion was prevalent. So for lack of a canteen, the battle was lost.

[silveroxide]

And now for those canteens.

In battle, one of the most important items that a soldier can carry, is water. Lack of H2O can kill just as well as bullets. In ancient warfare, one of the terror tatics used in a siege. was to poison the water. If the water was poisoned, then the siege would be a short one. While in the military service, I have had soldiers drink all of their water in a a day and have seen them succumb to heat exhaustion. This meant that I had to lose 3 men in the platoon temporarily , the injured man and two to take him back to the aid station. It cannot be emphasized enough, that water is a critical factor in war.

The photographs are self explanatory in the making of the canteens. There were various kinds used in the War between the States. One of the most widely used, were the tin canteens which were mostly rounded in shape like two bowls glued together. these were mainly used by the infantry. The horse soldiers tended to have a thick round version as depicted here. The Confederacy had theirs like the one depicted here but made out of wood. The Union troops had theirs with a felt lining on the outside to keep the water cool and usually had unit insignias on them.

And now, to work on some pails and other sundries.:):):)