the evolution from the mirage to 1:32 kfir

[YOAVHOZMI]

a lot of you my friends wondering and asking what the father of my big 1:32 kfir.....so the unswer is mirage 1:50 scale.

a long time ago at 2004, i purchased a silver mirage 1:50 scale.
the model was fantastic and very accurate, but had some mistakes of the outside shape that i can't fixed because it was silver paint and at that time i was not familiar with photoshop.


at 2009, after i got an experience with photoshop i decided to improve and re-paint that mirage.....so i drew it from the start and fixed all the mistakes and paint it with IAF camouflage colors.

another thing, i had to change the ventral fin, because the IAF MIRAGE did not have a rocket at the ventral fin under the tail.



puzzle that show the changes from the original to my version.







a year later at 2010, i decided to make a good kfir, becausu the IAF magazine kfir was bad and the hoby model was very very bad.

so i take my mirage version and converted it to kfir and change the color to gray.
i had to do a lot of changing that you can see at this puzzle.









at these days as you already knows, i work on the big one KFIR 1:32 scale.

i did not expand the 1:50 scale and print it.....
i drew from the start the big one, because if we expand a little model to a big one and print it, all the little mistakes and all the little distortions get bigger and the model don't looks very good.

so what i did???
i expand 1:50 kfir model at the computer to 1:32 and than i strat to drow it from the start and than built a white prototype.
after i built the white prototype, i start to look for a mistakes or any gaps between the parts and i found some.
so than, i back to the computer and fix all the body parts to get more accuracy.

after i got an accuracy model, i add the lines, the panels and all the screws and rivets to the body and at the end i paint it from the start.

oopss, i forgot, i also designed the cockpit ant the ejection seat.


so the big question is......who recognize the original model?

YOAV

[Tapcho]

YOAV - nobody is my answer. I believe every designer uses various sources for starting points: technical drawings, previous model designs, plastic kits whatever they got in their hands. This is your design and you can do whatever you want with it - which is of course share it if you wish so and let others build too. My two cents to this issue.

Tappi

[YOAVHOZMI]

Originally Posted by Tapcho

YOAV - nobody is my answer. I believe every designer uses various sources for starting points: technical drawings, previous model designs, plastic kits whatever they got in their hands. This is your design and you can do whatever you want with it - which is of course share it if you wish so and let others build too. My two cents to this issue.

Tappi

i also think like you Tappi.....but you know there are a lot of opinions with this subject.

however.....i opend this thread because there were a lot of speculations from where is my inspiration for my big 1:32 kfir? and i want to end those speculations. and show the way i did my thing.

thanks anyway for your support, it is very important to me.

YOAV

[mor54]

Yoav, I don't think that somone can claim for any connection between the two models. For an aircraft shape, there are limited number of foldout parts. As an example I looked at my big stoak of models, and found two card models of JAS 39 - one by Maly and the second by Hobby Model.



If you look at the nose parts and the wing, it is almost identical. It doesn't mean that one company used or copied the parts from the second.





As a modeler and lately as a model designer, I respect the copyrights of the modeling companys , but we all need not to take it to an extream position, or one day I will have to pay royalties to North American for the F-80 design !!

Shalom Mor

[Gene K]

Originally Posted by YOAVHOZMI

i I opened this thread because there were a lot of speculations from where is my inspiration for my big 1:32 kfir?

Thanks, Yoav - a very interesting and enlightening glimpse into how you create your masterpieces. I intentionally use the word "create" since, as far as I'm concerned, you essentially used an existing design as a reference point and worked from there. As you said, the original was an inspiration - a starting point that resulted in a model bearing very little resemblance to that original.

Again, I appreciate your detailed post as insight into your creative process -- hopefully it also serves to put to rest the "speculations" of the few.

Thanks!

Gene K

[maurice]

By all means keep talking.
Who knows you might even be able to convince me
... eventually ...
... perhaps.




However minor fumbling changes of a few shapes do not constitute original design.
The challenge is to start from scratch and learn how to create an original set of shapes onto which to apply indesputably excellent graphics skills.
Designer or fumbler of shapes and repainter, that's the choice.

[Rubenandres77]

The K-fir is a plane that interests me, but I had no hope of seeing a good one.
We in Colombia have had K-firs for as long as I remember, and Mirages even before that.
Your builds of this airplanes are very nice. I'm happy you managed to do all the improvements and correct the details to make it better.

To my eyes your finished kit is certainly different to the original model.
One would not think immediately of one being based on the another, but as two separate designs.
If i didn't knew you, or your work, I would think of them as separate unrelated kits.

They certainly look different. Both in details and in general shape, many things have changed enough. The side-by-side photos clearly show the differences.

I wonder how similar are they internally.
Did you have to change any of the inner structure to accommodate the external changes?

There are certain parts that are certainly very similar. Almost identical I would say. But they are unavoidable, like the landing gear. There aren't many different ways to approach the design of a nose landing gear of a specific plane.

I wish you could share the K-fir. I would certainly try to build it.

Regards,

[YOAVHOZMI]

Originally Posted by Rubenandres77

The K-fir is a plane that interests me, but I had no hope of seeing a good one.
We in Colombia have had K-firs for as long as I remember, and Mirages even before that.
Your builds of this airplanes are very nice. I'm happy you managed to do all the improvements and correct the details to make it better.

To my eyes your finished kit is certainly different to the original model.
One would not think immediately of one being based on the another, but as two separate designs.
If i didn't knew you, or your work, I would think of them as separate unrelated kits.

They certainly look different. Both in details and in general shape, many things have changed enough. The side-by-side photos clearly show the differences.

I wonder how similar are they internally.
Did you have to change any of the inner structure to accommodate the external changes?

There are certain parts that are certainly very similar. Almost identical I would say. But they are unavoidable, like the landing gear. There aren't many different ways to approach the design of a nose landing gear of a specific plane.

I wish you could share the K-fir. I would certainly try to build it.

Regards,

i changed more than a half of the body formers and did some new for the nose and the tail and the former of the engine.

i also made a new formers for the wings and for the rudder...i did them more simple to build.

and thanks for the comments.

YOAV

[Rubenandres77]

Originally Posted by YOAVHOZMI

i changed more than a half of the body formers and did some new for the nose and the tail and the former of the engine.

i also made a new formers for the wings and for the rudder...i did them more simple to build.

and thanks for the comments.

YOAV

Thanks for the additional information Yoav!

[YOAVHOZMI]

Originally Posted by maurice

By all means keep talking.
Who knows you might even be able to convince me
... eventually ...
... perhaps.




However minor fumbling changes of a few shapes do not constitute original design.
The challenge is to start from scratch and learn how to create an original set of shapes onto which to apply indesputably excellent graphics skills.
Designer or fumbler of shapes and repainter, that's the choice.

i didn't say it is my new design, i only said that it is my version and my improved model......it is a big diffrent, so please be more accurate in your words.

about "minor fumbling changes"....at the end i had to draw it from the start and make better parts, because a lot of part was not so symmetrical.

and i say it again.....i am not claiming for a new design.

YOAV