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  #41  
Old 08-22-2021, 11:33 AM
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rickstef rickstef is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diderick A. den Bakker View Post
So why was he banned from this forum?! A personal vendetta?! I vote he is reinstated as a member asap. Support very welcome.
He was banned because he advocated pirating paper models, under the argument that it was too expensive and too risky to order models from Europe or anywhere else in the World.

He persisted even when alternatives were offered, and he openly mocked the piracy by mentioning he was building illegally scanned/obtained models.

So, we as the administration of this forum made the decision to remove his access, and subsequently he was banned, as were his other 2 accounts, and his current PeteStein account is being monitored as well.

No personal vendetta, just trying to limit the influence of piracy in the hobby.

Rick
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  #42  
Old 09-02-2021, 06:13 AM
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Erik Zwaan Erik Zwaan is offline
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Empennage Part 2

Thanks again guys, let us concentrate on the KLM DC-4!

Building the horizontal stabilizers starts with the internal skeleton. Due to the design it's difficult to keep all the members of the structure straight without additional reinforcement.
Note that the stabilizers need to be exactly horizontal, which I visually checked by drawing a cross on a piece of paper and positioning the assembly right in the center of it.

The builder has two option: Stabilizer / elevator as one piece (simple version) or to have them separately.
For the simple version the installation of the horizontal stabilizers/elevators is relatively simple but when you choose to install the surface separately, the internal structure needs to be reinforced as I had difficulty outlining the various components properly without these additions.

In my opinion it works best by installing the elevators onto the stabilizer structure first.

The elevators have an elaborate skeleton, which however yields in a great assembly. In order to have a properly outlined trailing edge (fluent line between elevator rear end and fuselage rear-side curve) I had to glue a narrow strip of 0.5mm thick cardboard at the rear side of the aft spar, in between the elevator hinges. This will not really be visible later on.

Then, trimming of the fuselage skins at the wedge shaped part that close both upper and lower skins opposite of the elevator inner ends was required to have a good fit of the elevators at the rear spar.

Only after that I glued the elevators to the rear spars, thereby straightening the spars, by which the rest of the stabilizer structure was automatically pulled into the right shape.

Finally, I added two rectangular cardboard reinforcement "plates" in between the structural members. As you may see from the pictures concerned, this is a stable and strong assembly.

Then come the stabilizer skins. I glued the fairing parts along, in order to fit the skins to the fuselage in one go.

At this point I dry-fitted them a thousand times and I'm pretty confident it will work out well. Trimming of the skin at the mating ends with the fuselage is required, as well as adding a few more gluing tabs. Small corrections after gluing will be required to disguise any narrow gap, but now I'm heading too much into the future: It's a real time thread and I'm not that far yet.

All in all it took me a normal working day of 8 hours spread over the past one and a half weeks to reach this point but I'm quite pleased with the result. As you can see from the red horizontal line in the last picture, the alignment of the elevators is more than acceptable.

To be continued.....

Erik
Attached Thumbnails
KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7423.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7426.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7427.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7430.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7436.jpg  

KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7437.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7438.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7441.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7444.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7445.jpg  

KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7446.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7451.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7452.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7457.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7458.jpg  

KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7477.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7478.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7479.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7481.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7482.jpg  

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  #43  
Old 09-02-2021, 02:02 PM
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romanmodels romanmodels is offline
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good work Erik
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  #44  
Old 09-03-2021, 01:59 PM
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scon10 scon10 is offline
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If the elevator is covered by normal gauge paper/cardboard, why use so many profiles within the construction of the elevators? The paper will make it stiff enough, and half the profiles will give an accurate shape. Less profiles will save paper and ink. Or is there something I missed?
I would expect, from an engineering point of view, to use a full span spar or spars to make sure the tailplanes are in one line. Why are there two half spars, which need to be carefully aligned? Or did I miss something here too?
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  #45  
Old 09-03-2021, 04:00 PM
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Diderick A. den Bakker Diderick A. den Bakker is offline
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Simple answer: 1/50 makes a BIG model, the elevators are simply too big (15,5 cms each) to be fitted together: we work within the American letter size frame, which is only 27,4 cms.... And they would not even fit on European A4 size, either (29,5 cms). Cor and I considered the option of printing on A3 size, but that would have been very impractical for print-your-own builders!
Also the many formers will enable the builder to imitate the profile of the ribs on the surface by just slightly pressing the skin over the ribs.
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  #46  
Old 09-04-2021, 09:28 AM
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Erik Zwaan Erik Zwaan is offline
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Empennage Part 3

Gents,

A short update from the builder's end. Regarding the proper outlining of the stabilizers, scon10 has a valid point. The total span of the horizontal stabilizer measures slightly less than 24cm (9.5 inches). This would fit A4 or letter size paper. Do keep in mind it is a test-build (or second opinion as Cor already built the model) and things are not yet cast in stone.
I think Cor is already looking into this, to combine the spars and the central formers for easier outlining, and we discussed this before. This would simplify the build of the internal structure without impacting the current design too much, I'd say.

Apart from that, the empennage is a complicated part of the DC-4 as I have seen with my own eyes, with the convex fuselage transforming into a concave and narrowing empennage end. The model just captures this very well.

The number of ribs could be reduced but the current design results in robust and well formed elevators. As individual builder you can always leave out half of the ribs should you wish to do so.

Back to the build. With the earlier preparations, installing the skin at the right stabilizer was relatively simple. To aid proper shaping of the leading edge root at the fuselage, I installed a former just in front of the front spar, as you can see in the first picture.
The section with the PH on it is internally reinforced with an additional layer of paper, which is not fully covering the entire surface area. Surprisingly, you can see in the picture, there's a bit of light shining through where the paper has not been doubled, explaining the lighter patch. Normally not noticeable, apparently only in the picture.

As Diderick pointed out, the model is big and this is the reason why I double the fuselage and other larger areas at the inside as much as possible. It really provides a strong skin that will not dent easily.

For smooth mating I had to trim the edges here and there and applied thin paper to correct remaining small gaps. Apologies for the darker patches here and there, resulting from handling during dry-fitting and, indeed, also a few glue stains....

Without changing the design too much, it may be possible to combine a few skin parts, in order to reduce the number of seams / joints, will check this with Cor.

All in all a sunny Saturday morning well spent. On to the left stabilizer.

Erik
Attached Thumbnails
KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7540.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7543.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7544.jpg  
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  #47  
Old 09-04-2021, 01:42 PM
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scon10 scon10 is offline
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Using all the ribs (that's the word I was looking for) and lightly indenting the surface will indeed make the correct impression of the fabric-covered elevators as was used in the real thing, so that's a valid point, Erik.

The concave shape of the tail section is really impressing.

Builders of RC aircraft will know, that in hobbyshops you can get special fabric that is used to cover flying models. I imagine it can also be used on the elvators in this DC-4. Painting it in silver dope will make a real life-like impression for sure.
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  #48  
Old 09-09-2021, 10:02 AM
smithdr smithdr is offline
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Wow, Erik! I was away for a week...and you make this! What a wonderful job (as usual).


Dan
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  #49  
Old 09-09-2021, 10:23 AM
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Erik Zwaan Erik Zwaan is offline
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Empennage Part 4

Thanks for your reaction scon10 and Dan. It would be interesting to actually use cloth for the movable surfaces, but I wonder if the DC-4 had fabric coverings, they look metal cladded to me on various pictures of the original, perhaps except for the rudder.

The original "Rotterdam" had a shiny metal look but the repaint in the Aviodrome is light-greyish. Also, I doubt if the light blue surface in front of the windscreen was part of the original paint scheme. By looking at black and white pictures of the original PH-TAR, I get the impression it was just the same shiny metal.
That reminds me of a picture Isaac posted a few weeks ago, of a KLM DC-4 with a white top. I recently learned that KLM applied this white top to DC-4 aircraft flying to the tropics, such as the Dutch Caribbean (they used to refer to it as "the West") to minimize heat influx.

Horizontal stabilizers are now finished, and the final design slightly altered by Cor to minimize the number of joints. As I found the original joints too visible I corrected here and there with thin paper to disguise them. Also the bumper at the bottom side is installed now.

Then onto the vertical stabilizer. The rudder has the characteristic red-white-blue of the Dutch national flag and the nostalgic KLM logo. By the way, KLM stands for Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij, which simply means Royal Air Lines.

The build-up of the rudder is similar to that of the elevators. Lots of ribs and a nice result. Rather than tapering the skeleton edges as indicated in the instructions I just cut away the rim indicated by the dotted line.
I first glued the leading edge into the skin and aligned the trailing edges before the glue dried. Then either side was glued to the structure. It's best to use acetate glue for this.
Finally, sealing the trailing edge by a thin line of white glue and pressing the narrow gap close.

To be continued.....

Erik

The vertical stabilizer is still in its skeleton form. The structure looks a bit flimsy but is in fact quite strong.
Attached Thumbnails
KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7575.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7576.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7579.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7580.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7577.jpg  

KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7578.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7581.jpg   KLM DC-4/C-54 (Papertrade 1:50)-img_e7582.jpg  

Last edited by Erik Zwaan; 09-09-2021 at 10:25 AM. Reason: Somebody sneaked in between :)
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  #50  
Old 09-09-2021, 10:36 AM
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Erik


With so much material in the tail section, do not forget to add substantial weight in the nose so the model is not sitting on the tail.


Isaac
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