Paper model scaling

[golden oldie]

First of all,to all those in this hobby that actually design kits
I have to say they have my admiration,because its something
I wish I could do.
Having said that I have to wonder why there are so many
beautifully designed kits but no indication as to the scale of
the items.
This can be so frustrating and is not just prevalent in the free
items but some manufacturers create the same problem,in
particular many of the Polish/European brands where one has to
scour the printed pages to find some indication of scale ref...
why cant these makers put a scale on the cover like others do.

It dosnt really matter what one is designing a miniature of,there
must be some trigger or starting point to determine the size of
the subject..except I suppose in the case of Sci-Fi items where
scale can be open to conjecture.
I just feel it would be of great help to all,whereby they can then
print adjust to there own preferred scales.

I am currently trying to create a full scale listing of Star Trek
models (possibly cross matching with those that actually have
a scale) and also list there origins IE.. Movies..Series etc.
( It seems as fast as you add to list a new batch come out

Regards.... Dave

[Rubenandres77]

Dave, I agree with you when there are models that
don't state the scale. For people who prefer to
build a collection at certain scale, it is disappointing.

However, electronic kits are not difficult to measure and
scale, and turn them into the preferred scale one builds.

This happens a lot in free models. That's true.

I've also seen free models that have the scale stated in
the cover page. No matter how detailed or simple, there
are some good examples.

Your statement of some European models not telling the
scale on the cover surprises me. I try to recall commercial
European kits that don't state the scale, and at this point
I don't remember any. As far as I've seen when I visited the
websites of several shops, there's always a scale indicated.
All the serious publishers state their scale clearly on the cover page.
And even Russian and Polish electronic kits from new and
not so big publishers usually have the scale. But then,
my own experience with pre-printed models is very limited.


Now, as for the Sci-fi models, scale used to be a matter of
conjecture, as you said. More often than not, the measures
of the ships and vehicles is not found anywhere, making
scale definition a problem.

But the opposite is also true: with famous movies and franchises
lots of merchandise and related material can be found, and it
is very easy to find the measures of vehicles and ships. I can
remember the Colonial Marines' manual (or something like that)
where lots of information about the Aliens ships and artifacts
can be found. Including measures. Also, a friend of mine has
a very detailed book about ships, transports and weapons from
Star Wars, where measures were given.

But that's not always the case. I learned the other day that the
exact measures of Star Trek's original Enterprise where never
officially stated, and all the models where just derived from
approximation, extrapolations, and comparisons with the props
used in the show.

Anyway, I join the club of people who likes to see the scale of the
model clearly stated on the cover page, whether free or commercial.

[siurano]

I think sometimes is not that easy to do. I been trying to draw a vehicle I saw in a fantasy movie. I can do the drawing, but I don't have any reference to the real size of the vehicle. So I do it using proportions. There are people standing by it, but you really don't know how tall they are. I did try using internet to find data about it, but there was none. I did the drawing and now I'm doing the 3 (6) views to see if I can do the paper model!

[LouCoatney]

I provide a Scale Selector with my simple World War 2 cardstock paper ship models, so that the builder can create a model at whatever scale ... within reasonable limits ... s/he wishes:



Note that half the length of a 1:350 model would be a 1:700 model, etc.

If no one else had thought of this idea, please credit me if you use it ... and you are free to do so.

Of course, if you are designing a model for a specific scale and print/publish it as such, the ScaleSelector is unnecessary, although I agree you do need to specify what scale it is.

[Rubenandres77]

Originally Posted by LouCoatney

I provide a Scale Selector with my simple World War 2 cardstock paper ship models, so that the builder can create a model at whatever scale ... within reasonable limits ... s/he wishes:

Attachment 84920

Note that half the length of a 1:350 model would be a 1:700 model, etc.

If no one else had thought of this idea, please credit me if you use it ... and you are free to do so.

Of course, if you are designing a model for a specific scale and print/publish it as such, the ScaleSelector is unnecessary, although I agree you do need to specify what scale it is.

Lou, I don't understand well the Scale Selector. :(



What I did in the Ford Trimotor project (here) was (besides
stating the scale on the cover) to add a page with the scale
definition, and include a table indicating the % at which it
should be printed to achieve other scales:

[golden oldie]

Many thanks for your input rubenandres77
especially your mention of not coming across
any manufacturers that dont put some kind of
scale on their covers.
There is one that immediately comes to mind...
Maly Modelarz,their output has been quite
prolific over the years (since late 50s ) covering
ships,cars,trucks,and everything else,but they
never put a scale on their covers,you have to
sometimes trawl through the print to find the
scale.
Also many of the recent Canon offerings dont have
a scale reference anywhere,and likewise Streetpaper.

The whole essence of my post was why an individual
can spend so much time and talent,designing,drawing
and printing something (and lets admit some of them
are works of art ) without knowing the intended scale
when they first started.
It is purely my own observations and frustrations and
not necessary everyones,so I guess Ill just have
to live with it.

[rbeach84]

Golden, it is possible that the designers are "building" their original (i.e., master) at full scale. For example, when I'm working in AutoCAD, all inputs are at actual size units not 'scaled' units. If I want a 2x4 'stud', I draw it using real inch measurements, not 'miniature' or scale measurements hence the dimensions are input as '8 feet by 1.5 inches by 2.5 inches'. The 'hard copy', printed paper output is then plotted for whatever 'scale' artifact I wish and annotated accordingly. In effect, my digital representation is of the actual object *not* of the model object. I imagine other 3-D drawing software works in a similar fashion, it just makes sense when modeling real objects.

Also, there may be an effect known as "box scale" in plastic modeling taking place. The model is designed and then 'published' to a desired specific paper size, thereby giving what is essentially a random scale. Even if a scale is stated, I still try and verify what I'm actually getting - checking accuracy is an old habit.

To me (and obviously to you), scale is important because I like making size comparisions. To many, however, I think the model subject takes precedence. Perhaps a difference in how 'much' in one's balance of 'engineering' traits over 'creative' traits - sort of Spock vs Kirk? That is why you are bringing up this discussion. I would tend to agree that having a stated scale *and* proper scale 'rulers' in the kit is much more convenient. However, there are workarounds if needed, so I'm not sure if I am too peeved when the scale isn't posted, though I tend to shy away from buying unscaled kits since I may find they require more enlargement to be 1:48 scale (my preference) than is practical.

[LouCoatney]

Rubenandres, your percentage suggestions are good too ... *assuming* your initial scale is *exactly* right. :-)

In the case of my Scale Selector, the plan can be printed at any scale ... within reason ... fit to page size, if necessary ... and the builder will be able to produce it at any of the major scales (or multiples of them) he wishes. For that matter, the builder can produce it at ANY scale, with some basic calculations.

For example, my free Butler class destroyer escort plan was successfuly built at a larger scale than intended - the design was at 1:300 - by a US Navy DE veteran:

Lou Coatney: FREE BUTLER (USS Samuel B. Roberts, DE413) class U.S. Destroyer Escort

"Also, there may be an effect known as "box scale" in plastic modeling taking place. The model is designed and then 'published' to a desired specific paper size, thereby giving what is essentially a random scale." ... as I addressed in my reference to page size.

A Beach from Norfolk VA. Hmmm ... Any relation to either of the Edward Ls? :-)

[rbeach84]

No relation to the "famous" submariner... at least that I am aware of!