Fight Internet Pirates and Thieves: A Proposal

[thorst]

As I can understand the background of your proposal, I don't think it either solves the problem nor is it the (in my eyes) "right" strategy.

To be successful, I'd expect that more people buy your copy than that of the pirate. From my personal point of view, I get sceptical about both offers if there is such a huge price gap between both of them, on a product that is listed for over 100$ otherwise, I wouldn't expect a .50$ version to fulfill my wishes. I'm not rich and surely don't want to spend more money than neccessary, it's just experience that such an offer is too good to be true.

The other, and in my eyes more important aspect, is that even if you reach some people with your plan, the pirate just looses money but nothing more. He'll scan another item of which you surely won't get the licence to scan and share it and proceeds.

I'm almost sure that the pirates won't loose this or any similar battle because it's too hard to put them ALL in chains. We just can try to do the moral correctly, what is in my eyes, to report them to the copyright holders.

Best regards,
Thorsten

[cdavenport]

A unanimity of well expressed opinions. Certainly glad I asked though! Thanks for your replies.

[seaeagle2]

By the way, the one on Ebay for 175 has been on there for a month and it's still there. I think another one sold in a ebay "auction" as opposed to buy it now, for about 75 while this one was listed....

[airdave]

[you didn't think I wouldn't write a novel about this...did you?]


Although I question whether the Rose DC 3 is worth $175, it does have "collectible" value as an original Book rarity.
And for this reason it is of value to a certain type of collector.

A seller is entitled to ask any price they want for an item, without criticism
...but in the end the item will only be worth what someone is willing to pay.

However, high listing prices usually result in a false precedent and others follow suit expecting
to sell their items for higher prices. For this reason it is unfair for a respectable seller to overprice
his item just to make a buck.
(The ebay DC-3 model in question appears to have been purchased a few months back, on ebay,
solely for the purpose of reselling and making a profit. If I remember correctly he paid in the area of $90 for it.)

I would hope that all potential buyers will refrain from purchasing the item at such an inflated cost
to avoid establishing any further value precedent (regardless of how badly they want the item!).

I have an original Blade Runner theater issued Movie poster.
The original used and folded one sheets were rare and sought after and by the mid 90s were fetching prices approaching $800.
However, once ebay came along, the values became drastically over inflated...prices soared to well over $1000.
Many fakes and later issued posters were being offered and this confused and misled uneducated buyers.
Eventually the market soured as a result of ebay sales and now the posters are virtually worthless.
I could have sold my poster for some ridiculous price back then(and I am glad I didn't), but now I tried listing it at $180
and got zero interest.

Underpricing an item is just as important an issue in my opinion.
The only problem I see with offering a really cheap digital model on eBay, is it undermines other
legitimate sellers selling the same related products. This is just my feeling, but as a designer and seller
of models, I hate to see someone sell their item for less than what its worth, just to undercut me.

Comparing the selling (and piracy) of digitally available models to printed ones is unfair.
Piracy of printed models is a matter for the original owner/designer of the model, the original
publisher of the model, the copyright holder(s) of the printed matter ...and of ebay.

Unfortunately eBay doesn't care.
Ebay relies on their flawed VeRO group who respond only to large and influential copyright holders.
They are quick to shut down "smalltime" sellers but usually without proper investigation.
This works well in our favor (as protectors of modellers rights), but not very well for those selling in good faith.

And eBay doesn't respond well to the average buyers complaints.
(I just recently purchased a software item on ebay, listed as "BRAND NEW" right in the listing title.
After I received the item and tried to install (and register the software) I was notified that the program had already been registered to another client.
Based on the information I have, I can only conclude this is repackaged software of some sort.
After a lot of trouble and cost on my part, this "Ebay Power" seller still sells his wares, is still selling this particular item,
and ebay/paypal refused to issue me a full refund.)

I think its up to outside users, to constantly monitor sales on "evilbay"...look for piracy or property infringements...and then report
the offences to ebay demanding the removal of the listings. We should also band together to report any seller (en masse)
who is acting fraudulently or infringing on our copyrights. With enough constant pressure eBay may act and remove such sellers completely.

[Fishcarver]

Maj. Davenport:

In my particular case, you are preaching to the choir, because I'm right on point with you.

In this "wired" age, piracy is easy. But, if we want new and innovative models, then we have to support the designers and the publishers. Because they are the lifeblood of our hobby.

My I-400 model is a bit of a story. Might I share it here?

I bought the original designer's model at 1:400 scale for $24.95 online. I was laffed at at that time. hi, Mike!

At my own expense, I had the model enlarged to 1:200 scale at $20.00 per page.

Total cost for my model? $125.00. So what? I have a fairly decent model of the IJN "Sen Toku" in 1:200 scale . Even Tamiya can't do that!!

As I built it up, I found out that ETSUSAN the designer, had made a beautiful and well-fitting model of a classic warship.

Would I support another designer again?

ABSOLUTELY!

Piracy Sux!!

Jim

[goodduck]

very good said, airdave. but i think that free download undermines designers/sellers even more so then any pirates in ebay.

[goodduck]

$20.00 per page!!!!!!

[Fishcarver]

GoodDuck
I trust my printer!

Jim


The I-400 is a big boat, especially if rendered in 1:200 on matt photo paper

[jagolden01]

Originally Posted by goodduck

very good said, airdave. but i think that free download undermines designers/sellers even more so then any pirates in ebay.

I disagree with this completey. There will always be room for quality commercial models.
Very few free models reach the level of a good commercial model.

Simply because one person chooses to share their work freely should be no cause for loss of incentive. A well designed commercial model will always be worth the cost to a seious builder.

[airdave]

I think I understand what Allen meant...maybe he just didn't word it quite right?

If I was representing a for sale model here, like my Autocar
...and then Joeblow quickly designed a simpler version
and then competed for attention by offering it for free
...I would be a little perturbed.
I wouldn't be able to do much about it, but it would definitely hurt my sales and my feelings.

But I think I am also a good example of how free models can compliment commercial models.
(I call them "for sale" models...I guess its the same thing?)
But I wouldn't put an Autocar in my Koolwheelz collection, since it makes all the work I did on the 1/12 version redundant and unnecessary.

Yeah, theres no argument from me about sharing a model for free.
I can deal with that...in fact I will be the first to get my free copy.
And if someone wants to put that much work into a model and give it away, then all the more power to them.

Only real issue for me is with someone coming along with a similar model to mine
(same or lesser quality)
and putting it up for sale in the same location
but undercutting my price just to put me out of sales.
I guess a free model could do the same thing in this situation.

I wouldn't do that to someone else, and thats what I was talking about.