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Old 07-06-2011, 07:59 AM
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airdave airdave is offline
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A PT Boat from AirDave?

My next design project is a PT Boat.

wha?!! you are saying.
AirDave is into Boats now?!

No, not really
This is gonna take a little explanation.
(You know how I hate to talk, but this requires some story tellin')

A long while back, a friend here, asked me if I could help him repaint a free downloaded PT Boat model.
I don't have a lot of personal interest in Boats, although I am fascinated by Submarines
and love a good Pirate ship!
But I didn't have the time to do it and politely declined.
Later he did a great job of designing a small PT Boat model of his own!

Since that time, the issue of a PT Boat has come up a few times.

I've built up a big interest in watching the classic TV show McHales Navy.
Who doesn't like Tim Conway and Ernest Borgnine?

Like a lot of people, I am always interested in documentaries and TV specials
surrounding the life of times of one of America's greatest Presidents.
And whenever talking about John F Kennedy, the topic of PT 109 always comes up.

I got more and more interested in creating a model of PT109 and the fictional PT73.
So I started saving websites, collecting images and diagrams, watching videos.
[by the way, theres a great 3 part video on YouTube about the 1940s Elco PT Boat production...search for "PT Boats - Giant Killers"]

I collected a couple of free internet models (like Oliver Biziers little gem)
and even bought a couple of PT Boat models (like the T-1425 Torpedo Boat from bestpapermodels)

I needed to understand the shape of the hull and how the Hulls are designed, to see if this was something I could tackle.
After some thinking and scribbling, I decided "I can handle this"...

First thing that baffled me was the variety of methods used to create a paper Hull.
Too many differences to point me in one direction.
But there were some similarities, and eventually I figured out the curves up near the bow
(keep in mind, I design in 2d, on the flat)
and with some print and cut, fit and trim, reprint and recut, refit and retrim...
I have managed to mockup up a basic Hull!
...which I can now expand and build upon.

A PT Boat from AirDave?-pt-boat-prototype-topside.jpg A PT Boat from AirDave?-pt-boat-prototype-underside.jpg

My first project will be PT 109 (an Elco 80' PT Boat)
and unless I have a change of heart, I plan on creating it in the proper
Green finish (with copperoyd bottom)

The grey I will save for PT73!
PT 73 from TVs McHale's Navy, was a fantasy PT Boat actually built on top of British Vosper boats
...the real navy PT-73 was a Higgins Torpedo Boat.
But I don't see any problem with repainting my Elco design into a fantasy rendition
of the McHale's Navy PT Boat.

..................................

Which brings to me the part where I ask for help...

before I do anything else, I need to settle on a scale size for the model.
This also will help me determine the level of detail in designing certain components for the deck of the boat.

1/72 scale means the model will be about 13" long.
Bigger than 1/72 makes the design work easier, but creates a bigger need for chopped up panels and parts.
My current prototype is only about 8" and is too small for me to design
detailed or overly complicated Machine Guns and deck equipment.
Preferences? Opinions?

If you are interested in a PT Boat...mainly an Elco 80'...
are there specific models you want to suggest?
Or, is PT 109 (and PT73) the main request?

I am also thinking about a smaller scale model (less parts and detail, remember)
but providing it with other accessories...ie a Diorama Kit.
any thoughts on that?
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Old 07-06-2011, 08:22 AM
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Miles Linnabery Miles Linnabery is offline
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Dear Airdave:
I'm falling in with the idea bigger is better, how about 1/32 or 1/35 scale with lots of detail? However the Idea of 1/76, 1/72 scale might be better idea for number of pages ect. Good luck Dave I will look forward to your interpertation of an icon of the Navy.
Thank you,
MILES
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Old 07-06-2011, 08:31 AM
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Looking good, Dave. I's think somewhere between the 1/72 - 1/32-35.
Maybe 1/48?

I like 'em large but as you said, it will lead to a lot of sectioned panels and pages.

Joe
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Old 07-06-2011, 08:34 AM
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1/72 would be my call....

Wyvern
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Old 07-06-2011, 09:47 AM
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hows that for a concensus of opinion?! lol

3 post...3 different suggestions! haha

1/32, I think, is too big.
That makes the model over 30" long and will require a lot more design than I am prepared for.

Even 1/48 makes for a big model, but at least it offers me the chance to design some
proper deck equipment.
Its still a big scale, requiring me to cut up the largest parts (Hull panels and Deck) into
two, three or more parts to properly fit onto Letter size pages.
I would definitely need to get suggestions on how to break up those parts (from you guys)

1/72 and 1/100 are a more manageable scale for display, but cause a problem for designing
and assembly of deck components.
I know that when I built Kooklik's deck guns at 1/100 scale, I did not do too well.
In fact I gave up and designed flat 2D guns!

I am tentatively saying that 1/48 will be my largest scale option
and 1/100 would be the smallest.
So...I need more opinions on scale before I continue.




I didn't include 1/64 scale in this comparison, as I thought it was not a standard Boat Model scale.
I was apparently wrong on that assumption.
And Lindbergh Models actually produced a 1/64 PT Boat Model in the early 1960s
and it might be a balanced option between 1/72 and 1/48 scale.

It makes the finished model about 15" long and although it still requires splitting up some
parts to make them fit on pages, it also provides a workable scale for small deck parts.

Something to consider.
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Last edited by airdave; 07-06-2011 at 09:59 AM.
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Old 07-06-2011, 10:23 AM
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Current PT Boat model availability?

There are (plastic) boats in 1:35 (I think...), 1:32 (for certain), 1:64 as you've noted, 1:72 and I think that might be about it. You probably know what is available in paper kits. As a big 1:48 scale guy, and since there are none available already, I'm inclined to 'vote' for 1:48 as a good candidate. Also, as you've noted, the larger size allows for easier detailing options. Granted, taking that to larger scales helps even more with the detailing, but then you're dealing with the page counts and greater number of 'page' related seams.

I suppose it comes down to whatever variable is most important to you, since you're the designer! As I can print easily to 11 x 17 paper, going from letter size paper (8.5" > 12.75", well, that doesn't fit, but 11">16.5" does fit...) scaling up from 1:72 is usually 'do-able' if the original borders are generous.... like Roman does with his designs, fits both letter & A4 papers. From my perspective, whatever can most easily scale to 1:48, either 'up' or 'down', that is "what floats my boat".

Sorry, couldn't resist that one...
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Old 07-06-2011, 11:47 AM
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Dave,

I'm not a great boat builder, though I've built a couple. 1:64 seems about right to me, as I tend to do WWII aircraft at 1:60. I've done a couple at 1:72, but for my stubby fingers, that's a bit much. Anyway, that's my 2-cents worth.

I'll be watching your progress with interest.

Garland
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Old 07-06-2011, 11:57 AM
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Hello, Dave!

May I suggest to do it in 1/100 first, so it can easily be converted to other scales without much ado. If doing it in 1/100, please think of arranging the parts into a frame fitting for letter and DIN A4 format likewise. I'm looking forward to your progress.

Kind regards,
Papercaptain
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Old 07-06-2011, 12:04 PM
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Thank you Dave thank you
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Old 07-06-2011, 12:05 PM
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For those of us with multiple modeling interests...how about 1:87? IMHO, PT-109 is already overly done, with sufficient memorialization to a skipper who lacked the presence of mind to clear his baffles before putting the pedal to the metal. On the other hand, I'm still buying DVD sets featuring PT-73....go for it.
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