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  #11  
Old 06-14-2020, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peaceglue View Post
Hallo Airdave,

I just see your thread for the first time. I builded Ken West's X-15, too. The cockpit section was most difficult for me. I made a building report. But of course (for me) in german language.
Here is the link: https://www.kartonbau.de/forum/thema...5-1-32-fertig/
I hope you can use it.
Besides: you made a clean and very good build!
Photos help! thanks
And, I can google translate the text.

But I still didn't see how you fitted the cockpit!
So my question still stands..."can I come back to it and fit the cockpit later?"
What do I have to do right to make that possible, if anything?
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  #12  
Old 06-14-2020, 12:52 PM
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I skipped the cockpit on my two X-15 builds and someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think as long as you build the basic cockpit tub, you could, in theory, come back later and add the cockpit details as a drop-in assembly.
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  #13  
Old 06-14-2020, 12:53 PM
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Hello airdave,


as far I remember your plan, to make the cockpit as an alternative may fail.


The cockpit "room" is a part of the hull-structure. It is necessary for the frontsection. On the pics you can see long small paper stripes left and right from the backside. these stripes close the open sides between outer hull and the cockpit"room" walls. Sorry for my bad English. But nevertheless I hope (of course) it helps.


The only thing I made removeable was the ejection seat.



Sincerely peaceglue!
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  #14  
Old 06-14-2020, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peaceglue View Post
Hello airdave,


as far I remember your plan, to make the cockpit as an alternative may fail.


The cockpit "room" is a part of the hull-structure. It is necessary for the frontsection. On the pics you can see long small paper stripes left and right from the backside. these stripes close the open sides between outer hull and the cockpit"room" walls. Sorry for my bad English. But nevertheless I hope (of course) it helps.


The only thing I made removeable was the ejection seat.



Sincerely peaceglue!
Peaceglue's insights are probably correct. Upon reflection (and looking at the parts again) I'm not sure there's a "tub" that can be dropped in.

That's not to say you couldn't tweak Ken's design and add that feature....
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  #15  
Old 06-14-2020, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peaceglue View Post
Hello airdave,
as far I remember your plan, to make the cockpit as an alternative may fail.
The cockpit "room" is a part of the hull-structure. It is necessary for the frontsection. On the pics you can see long small paper stripes left and right from the backside. these stripes close the open sides between outer hull and the cockpit"room" walls. Sorry for my bad English. But nevertheless I hope (of course) it helps.
The only thing I made removeable was the ejection seat.
Sincerely peaceglue!
after looking at your photos, I was thinking the same thing.
That the tub itself may have to go in...but I can omit the interior details.
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  #16  
Old 06-14-2020, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airdave View Post
As I mentioned, the double former, butt join method is not my favorite.
This is about the fourth model (of this style of assembly) that I have tried in the last 15 years
and this is the fourth time I have been unhappy and disatisfied.

I think the biggest issue is the white finish, which makes the seams and joints stand out more than usual,
and any imperfections or misalignments of fuselage connections are glaring.

I have decided to experiment with tabbed joiner strips...something I am more comfortable with.
(I can include these in the kit, and the builder can choose whatever build style they want)

Following my usual aircraft fuselage method, I start at the nose...assembly the first section with a simple strip joiner..
then add a full tabbed strip to the rear of the section....
then connect the next (pre-formed/pre-assembled) fuselage section...
THEN install a single former into the fuselage positioning it at the seam.

Then attach the next section and repeat...


You'll notice an extra inner strip of card in the nose...this is where a former fits.
I want to avoid the deformation I experienced on the first build.

Fitting the front Wheel Well didn't go easy since it is a bit wider than the cutouts in the bulkhead formers.
Not sure why...part of Ken's design I assume.
But with some trimming I got it in, and carefully edged glued it into the fuselage.

For now I am going to assemble the entire forward fuselage, into the cockpit area, with tabbed joiner strips.
I am still considering the rest of the fuselage.



I was a bit confused by the upper(aft cockpit) area and how it all connects,
but I understand it now.
I had an idea to make some assembly changes in this area, but I decided to go ahead with Ken's method,
albeit, I will be only installing single bulkhead formers wherever butt join double formers where intended.

I am most happy with the fuselage connections up front...its the best I could hope for with my skills.
The joiner strip method helped me immensely.

Please note...I allowed the joiner strips to show through in these photos due to back lighting.
and I still did not use 110lb cardstock as Ken suggested which would be a bit more opaque.
But regardless, once completed, the cardstock will not appear this translucent.



I am not planning on installing the cockpit.
I want to build it with canopy closed so you get the full effect of how the white X15 looked.
I want it to be tight and streamlined with the closed canopy.

But I want to keep the option open to install the cockpit later if possible.
Can I do this? Can I come back later and drop in the cockpit with all the bulkheads already in place?

Sainted bovines, that is a thing of beauty!
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  #17  
Old 06-14-2020, 04:01 PM
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I am struggling a bit trying to figure out the cockpit tub assembly.
I'll have to go through peaceglue's photos, and all the other photos i have collected so far.

I wish Ken had done a diagram of the cockpit...his text instructions are there,
but I do love me a picture or two!

Anyway, I have discovered that there isn't a "tub" that can be built and dropped in later.
The "tub" is formed using two of the bulkhead formers, so I am putting that together
and will install the two formers as one unit.

I making up paper tabs right now to join everything together,
but I'm already thinking about creating a few joiner strips for the kit.

I'll take some photos and show you my method once I get that far.

It looks like half of the cockpit will be installed, so I may as well finish it
and put the rest of the details in place.
Regardless, I still may glue the canopy down in the closed position.
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  #18  
Old 06-14-2020, 09:04 PM
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Looking great Dave!

Mike
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  #19  
Old 06-16-2020, 03:24 PM
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I posted something yesterday, but its not here. Maybe I didn't publish the post?
I'll try again...

Cockpit Tub is complete and other cockpit parts are ready for fitting.
The two bulkheads that frame the cockpit "tub" are now part of the entire tub
and I will slide the entire assembly into the fuselage from the rear opening before I attach the next fuselage section..



Since I am not good with edge gluing parts together, I added thin paper strips to hold everything together.
By wrapping paper tabs around everything, it made for a quicker and easier assembly, and stronger cockpit.



...
The cockpit tub is solid but is now a bit too big to fit into the fuselage.
I'm not exactly sure why, since the paper strips are very thin and it added less than .5mm to the diameter of the bulkheads.

I had thought about this, thats why I pre-cut the bulkhead formers inside the printed lines to make them smaller.
But the tub is still way too tight and it sits too high in the opening.

So I applied a bit more glue to the seams inside the cockpit 'tub' and I sanded down the bulkhead formers and all the edges of the 'tub'
...eventually it will fit into the fuselage. I'll make it fit!

And then...the other part that is the side rail edges of the cockpit opening
is way too narrow for the tub...about 1mm too narrow!...maybe another byproduct of the oversize 'tub' I don't know?
So I have added a second layer of printed part that folds over the sides effectively making the part another .6mm wider.
It should help fill in some of the space.



...
The Instructions say to "Install 4c into upper edge of part 4."
4c being the small crescent shape former part,
and #4 is the fuselage section at the front of the cockpit opening.

But there is no indication as to exactly where to fit the part 4c
...should it be way underneath?...forward? back? straight up? angled?



It appears as though it might sit at the front edge of the Side Rails.
So I glued it there (to the side rails).
Is this going to cause me trouble during installation?



...
I dry fitted everything I have assembled so far...I'm still unsure how the instrument panel and cowling will fit,
but it looks like everything is coming together.
My adjustments to the size of the tub seemed to have worked and I will be able to pull the fuselage tight
and get the side rails glued up properly within the opening.



Please tell me if something is way wrong here.
...
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  #20  
Old 06-24-2020, 08:46 PM
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With my current house clean up and repair situation, I have lost my paper modeling workspace.
And while I managed to set up my computer desk, I have only the basics connected (no printer),
so I can't print the necessary parts to continue with this build anyway.

It may be a week...or two...or more...before I can get back to test building.
But for those interested in this project, I just wanted to post an update.
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