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  #21  
Old 08-10-2011, 02:36 PM
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From planking a ship, the garboard planks are complicated and uniquely shaped. This is a pretty little ship and simpler to rig than a ship or a barque....would be fun
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regards Glen
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  #22  
Old 08-10-2011, 05:00 PM
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I don't know Gil it looks pretty boatiful to me.
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  #23  
Old 08-10-2011, 07:05 PM
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Concur with B-manic. Of course, Cap'n Slocum (re)built the original by eye in a field using a salvaged keel and hardware along with a tree or two. I think your rendition will be as faithful as any other - and the design process is mesmerizing ...

Yogi
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  #24  
Old 08-10-2011, 09:01 PM
Zathros Zathros is offline
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Gil, I think the garboard planks are too thin. A gradual widening would leading to them would give the boat a more traditional New England style. Even Weston's inaccurate drawings and other interpretations of the Spray seem to indicate the same. Unless one was building a fiberglass outline of the Hull, then it would make no difference.

I banged out, shapes based on Weston's loft, and they look like the same shapes that you see on the old wooden boats around here (I live in Connecticut, lived in New England all my life). (These renders are horrible and crude but they are just a visual reference to Weston's drawings and other similar vessels I have seen like this).

Now, this is just a technical note, not having anything to do with the incredible Renderings you have posted. It would seem that a boat with the provenance of the Spray would call out for this. This does not mean anything really, but if this is possibly going to end up as the only model of the Spray, it would be nice to see some of the parabolic non uniform curves that made these ships such a wonder, and gave them their strength, and made people wonder, "How did they know how to do that?".
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  #25  
Old 08-10-2011, 10:40 PM
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Gil Gil is offline
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Answer to Queries

Not to be obstreperous to queries, a strake count of the image below yields a tad more than the 15 divisions used. 15 was a nice number because the division point lies on the keel stem to the hull's wineglass intersection - very convenient.

Now repeat after me: "the original is no longer in existence, existing documentation sucks and as long as it looks like pictures of the original, no one will ever be the wiser nor able to argue the point"....,

+Gil


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  #26  
Old 08-11-2011, 12:34 AM
Zathros Zathros is offline
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There is more consensus on this boat than you lead people to believe. The sailing history is quite alive. People build boats out here all the time (New England, where I live, all my life, more than half a century), and the art is not lost. I obviously hit a nerve with you. Sorry, I did not intend to. I just thought that you spent so much effort, 8 hrs you said, on one Rendering. Now that you had the textures and all the other Rendering properties set, you could review the technical aspects. Anyone who works with Rhino knows this is not as difficult as it appears. Most of these planks you could "Run 2 Rails" on. If someone was going to build this out of paper, the lines would be visible. The lines on your boat are wrong for a ship of that era. That's a fact. This is not a statement of Slocum's boat, but of boats of that era. It almost as you looked at the boat from the side and thought the planks were that thin. Some sort of parallax set in and you didn't take advantage of perfectly fine drawings that are readily available and easy to model with Rhino, that would have represented the hull far better.

...

Last edited by 3Turner; 08-11-2011 at 07:56 AM. Reason: deleting portion unrelated to thread subject
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  #27  
Old 08-11-2011, 04:46 AM
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Straking

Hi Zathros,

I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say. The strake lines are in concurrence with photographs contained in references [printed books] I've collected over time [especially the bow view]. The method for spiling the hull is the generally accepted method used by shipwrights for centuries. I think what you're making reference to is the number of divisions used. Fewer divisions creates a faceted look to the hull [i.e. 12-13] so 15 was chosen as the best overall fit [top two shear strakes are not in this count].

+Gil
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  #28  
Old 08-11-2011, 05:02 AM
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Drag it Down...,



I think this is uncalled for. After you rethink this you may want to offer an explanation in the form of an apology.

+Gil

Last edited by 3Turner; 08-11-2011 at 07:58 AM. Reason: deleted quote unrelated to thread topic
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  #29  
Old 08-11-2011, 08:35 AM
Zathros Zathros is offline
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"Now repeat after me: "the original is no longer in existence, existing documentation sucks and as long as it looks like pictures of the original, no one will ever be the wiser nor able to argue the point"....,

+Gil"

Sorry, I just did not understand this seemingly condescending remark. The garboards are too thin for a boat from New England. That's all. Boats in this area are not made with thin planking like that. Of course, I do agree about faceted work, i.e. Bolger, which makes for quick builds, but look like boxes with sharp ends, hence "Sharpies", though on a reach, they sail like a rocket. If you traced out the lines on any of the loft drawings as I posted above, or looked at the "crude" pictures I posted, you would see the general elongated 1/2 "split football" parabolic curve that I am trying to explain. This is what the garboards look like. The are stronger, at the most rigid part of the boat, the keel, as they move upwards towards the gunwale, they become thinner, thinnest around the transition from the bottom to the sides, and tend to get a little wider towards the top again, this is an engineered elastomeric property that allows the boat to flex. These Oyster boats were driven up on beaches, or sometimes grounded on low tides and a thin strip hull would never do, strength wise. Maybe for a small lifeboat.

I will leave you alone in this thread. You Renderings are obviously some of the best around. We have "conversed" many times over the years. I guess there has been a change. Good luck! I did not mean to offend, I guess I misunderstood: "Now repeat after me" and makes the statement you made, well 'nuff said. No apology needed, Thanks anyway.

Last edited by Zathros; 08-11-2011 at 08:50 AM.
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  #30  
Old 08-11-2011, 09:28 AM
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Wonderful work, Gil. I am jealous of your skills and completely humbled. My own Rhino work seems like primitive scratchings in dirt by comparison. I love the renderings also.

Your hours of work on research and the keyboard are really paying off!


Carl
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