SVG or PDF for distribution...

[DougH]

Vector PDF gets my vote

[psf]

I'm a huge proponent of SVG graphics for almost anything related to 3rd order Bezier curves. It's XML and represents the curve data in a readily interpreted open standard. PDF is a proprietary format.

However, SVG is not a publishing format. For greater printing accessibility the superior format is PDF, as that is its primary purpose. SVG on the other hand is a vector data format, not a document exchange format. An abstract example is that a multi-page document cannot be encapsulated by one SVG, rather it requires multiple files. Font embedding and other such publishing issues (in the case of instructions) also raise concerns.

My workflow is CAD software for design, Inkscape for simplification of curves and texturing/coloring, Scribus for PDF output.

Without some context as to what the printing difficulties were it's difficult to offer another input. However, scaling issues with SVG printing from the browser are hit or miss as well as they'll depend on how your SVG is constructed, and whether or not the print options of the printer/browser behave uniformly.

[looker]

Sorry. Didn't realize it was one of 'those' issues. I wasn't intending to stir any pots.

No, no, just meant you've asked some searching questions that have prompted responses.
You're obviously well into the more arcane aspects of computers which leaves us simple folk way behind. Whilst you need the facility to text read the actual code most others around here don't have that ability.

Might I suggest that what is most useful for the majority on this forum is a .pdf file that will open in standard run of the mill windows and mac programs and without the potential problems mentioned above by psf.

Printing areas were of course discussed at Hhrrrmph! Margins! and A4 and US Letter PDF Compatibility? but if you also actually draw an enclosing rectangle and label it with it's size in inches and millimeters (lots of us like mms) then physically checking the printed size of that rectangle will let folks know if they are looking at exactly what you intended even when they can't read text code.

[cfuruti]

Originally Posted by Revell-Fan

*.svg files are not imported and displayed correctly by all applications. *.pdf is safer. If you are uncertain, you may decide to offer *.svg AND *.pdf files of the same model.

I only use SVG in drawing software, not browsers, so my experience may be limited - but I've found inconsistent rendering across PDF applications as well.
I agree, for the builder, PDF is easier to use (multipage support comes to mind) and probably more widely supported. But SVG would be a big bonus for customizers. You might offer SVG versions as a companion package.

[cfuruti]

Originally Posted by looker

SVG can do clever things on web pages and is best left there.
Modelers don't need those clever things in the kits they will be printing and pdf reliably and rigidly conveys the information needed.

I disagree. Both SVG and PDF include interactive features which our hobby has little use for, but don't discount SVG, which can be thought of as an intermediate format (like DXF or CDR, used by drafting/CAD software) while PDF is more strictly a presentation format (in the sense which is more "final" and harder to edit). Builders might not need "clever things", but modelers could well benefit.
For example, most of my builds (distributed as a set of JPGs or unlocked PDF/PDO; in the latter case, I use a virtual printer to convert to PDF) have used this overflow:

1. load each JPG or PDF page into Inkscape, save as SVG (in the case of JPGs, this ensures printing consistency, since SVG and PDF include real-world size information, unlike JPG)
2. customize pages, heavily using vector features and layers. I have not vectorized anything so far, but frequently use Inkscape as a poor-man's CAD
3. export pages as PDF, optionally join them with PDFBox and print

I always preserve the SVG version, in case further modifications are needed; layers (technically SVG groups) and SVG filters are fundamental features since they allow replacing or hiding original features without destroying information.

Of course, I've not used 3D software for customization; in that case, PDO could be a better choice.
And yes, if you only want to build, not tweak/tune]repaint, PDF is best. Uh, maybe not - AFAIK, SVG can't harbor viruses

[Formerly Styrene]

Friends & Modelers,

I am an avid Linux user so SVG files are opened and display well (as far as I can tell) on my system, but having said that I must say that my open source system plays very well indeed with PDFs.

I can create them with a number of free programs and GIMP or Krita allow me to load any page from a PDF to modify or rescale. Since I am currently working on a RR layout with an extensive town scene in N scale this comes in very handy, because most buildings, cars, RR cars, etc available on the 'net are in HO scale or other larger scales.

Of course when working with a graphic in GIMP I use the native .xcf format, it is similar to the .psd format in that it supports layers, alpha channels etc.

There is even a program called "PDF Chain" that allows me to load any number of smaller PDFs and save them as a single larger PDF.
So the long and short of it is,
Don't fear the PDF.

Just my 2 cents,

Formerly Styrene
aka
David

[NevadaBlue]

PDF.

That said, you will find LOTS of people who have no idea how to print anything, much less a PDF. Reading is necessary in most cases, reading instructions that is. (Grin)

[Dabeer]

Originally Posted by JohnM

My preference is for .pdo, seconded by .pdf. I must admit that I don't know what SVG files are, but I'm a builder not a designer.

Just my $0.02, but I can't stand .pdo (pepakura) models - they just seem far too geometric for my tastes.

Please do package SVGs as a PDF. Anyone who wants access to the SVG can open the PDF in Inkscape (or tool of their preference) to get it, but most probably won't know what to do with an SVG file - whereas everyone and their sister has a PDF viewer/printer.

[cfuruti]

Originally Posted by Dabeer

Just my $0.02, but I can't stand .pdo (pepakura) models - they just seem far too geometric for my tastes.

This kind of generalization is misleading and does not contribute to the OP's discussion. Whether a model seems "geometric" (I assume that means blocky, or with a low polygon count) depends on the 3D model and effort and skill of the modeler, not on the published format*. Also, it's hard to know whether a non-PDO, less-geometric model was not actually developed with Pepakura, tweaked, then converted.
I concur that most PDO files seem blocky, but I guess that's related to the fact that Pepakura, being so inexpensive, considerably lowered the bar for aspiring publishers, therefore opening the gates for less-than-polished models. Other aspects suggesting that time and money committed are more a issue:

• PDO files mostly obviate creating instructions, a long and tedious process
• amateur modelers often import ("rip") 3D meshes from computer games; such data are low-poly for better performance

BTW do you consider ¥Ú¥Ñ¥¯¥é¥Ç¥¶¥¤¥Ê¡¼ : ¥®¥ã¥é¥ê¡¼ or ¥Ú¥Ñ¥¯¥é¥Ç¥¶¥¤¥Ê¡¼ : ¥®¥ã¥é¥ê¡¼ "geometric"?

* the cheapest version of Pepakura limits the texture size to 1K x 1K, but I don't know about the poly count

Originally Posted by Dabeer

Please do package SVGs as a PDF. Anyone who wants access to the SVG can open the PDF in Inkscape (or tool of their preference) to get it, but most probably won't know what to do with an SVG file - whereas everyone and their sister has a PDF viewer/printer.

Not exactly. A locked PDF can't be imported by Inkscape. Also, the two formats aren't two-way conversible; e.g., if you export SVG as PDF, filters are rasterized - no way to precisely get back to vectors.
But yes, certainly PDF caters to a wider audience.

[imcold]

PDF for most people will be better, as others said (most people have some sort of PDF reader). If you want to allow easy edits of patterns, textures, etc. publish the SVG as well.
I don't know what's your pipeline like, but I have several separate svg files with patterns, instructions and such that I combine to one pdf at the end - it's more convenient to distribute.

Few notes:
* PDF is an open format for a long time as well - you can get the specification. If your PDF file is compressed (most are), you can convert it to text form and look inside as well (SVG is clearer tho IMHO).
* I've seen printing issues both with PDF and with SVG, there's just no guarantee that any of them will work perfectly.

cfuruti: while you're correct that locked PDF can not be imported by Inkscape, you can still convert them to unlocked if you know the password for viewing, and import afterwards.