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Old 02-14-2011, 09:56 AM
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Card Stock Questions from a new kid on the block

Hi:

I have posted a few times to Paper Modelers but I am very new to building models of paper, or any other type modeling for that matter. My question is about card-stock and the different paper that the members use to create these wonderful models.
I built my first model, US Civil War Mortar Boat #10, a free download from Paper Shipwright, using a sheet of business card paper and it seemed to work with few problems. The model is small, 1:250 scale with a length of 8cm and a width of 3cm and so I did not have problems with the paper warping or crinkling. I learned some of the basics with this build and then rebuild the boat using Hammermill Cover Stock, 67#. This also seemed to work with few paper problems. I then moved on to my next project, a 1:72 T-70 Russian tank from Paper Modelers free download. Using the Hammermill paper I found that cutting curved lines to be difficult because of the small size of the wheels and other curved parts. I attempted the cutting with sizzlers, razor blade, and a swivel knife. I could not seem to get a good curve cut with any of these tools. I did reprint the model a number of times and finally did get somewhat satisfactory results. Still not anywhere near the quality of models that I have seen on this web site. I have completed several small projects, small in scale and simple in complexity, since the T-70, that required few curved cuts and the paper I used seemed to work well. I have now almost completed my second AFV, a 1:33 1929 T-12 Russian Tank from the downloads on this site. I used Wausau Paper White Cardstock that I found at a discount store. The package did not have a pound or pt. number so I can't tell you much about it but that it seems about the same thickness as the Hammermill 67#. In building the larger parts of the body of the tank I found that there is some warping and I can't get a flat surface on the sides or top. So much for background now on to the questions.

How do you determine what weight of paper to use for a model? I have read through the forums here and you say that paper thickness of .008” to .009” should be used for 1:33 scale models and that .007” to .008” should be used for 1:50 scale models. How does this translate in to paper weight? What is the thickness of 67# cardstock? 110# cardstock? What is the thickness of a 3x5 index card? (I have also read that some people use index cards to make some parts of a model) . What about lamination. Some instructions say that some parts are laminated to a thickness of 1 mm. I have attempted to laminate some of the parts but then have problems bending/folding those parts. Also when laminating large parts the paper seems to warp or disfigure from the glue. I have tried several types of glue (Elmer's School Glue Gel, all purpose white glue, Loctite Professional Wood Worx, Aleene's Tacky Glue, a Liquid Glue Pen from Desk Bond) and have the same problem with all of them. I have attempted to reduce the amount of glue and I have thinned the glue but that does not seem to help.

That is it for now. I know that I will have lots of questions in the future. I just have to say that this is a great site and the photos of the models are the major reason that I have gotten into doing paper models. (I want to build close to the level that you all do) After looking at the work that you have done and reading all the great posts here I feel that this is a great community of people and I want to become a part of it.


Thanks from a new kid on the block,
Jerry


Attached are two photos of the T-12. I still have the exhaust to finish.
Attached Thumbnails
Card Stock Questions from a new kid on the block-t-12-714b.jpg   Card Stock Questions from a new kid on the block-t-12-715b.jpg  
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Old 02-14-2011, 10:27 AM
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doctormax doctormax is offline
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Welcome to the forum. well most use spray glue for the lamenation i don't i just use the cheapest white glue i can find. what i do is put a bit on the bit to glue spread out as thin as possilble then put under a heavy weight and leave for a at least 12 hours. Sometimes even days. The record time for leaving a bit for lamination under the weight was three days and it was about the best ever maybe that was me hoping. weight of paper I just use one weight for everything and I think it be 110 lb US since it is about 160 grm for Europe. You will find lots of people like some brand of glue and have tried lots of them myself i have just tried three glues ever and found a spray glue i bought was USELESS and I am not going to go and hop off to a shop and spend 20 euro on 3M mounting glue.
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Old 02-14-2011, 10:34 AM
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doctormax doctormax is offline
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maybe on the exaust it best to print on thin paper since it probably needs to be rolled and I find that the 110 is not so good for rolling into a part that is quite small.
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Old 02-14-2011, 10:34 AM
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Paper Weight - Conversion Chart has a chart showing the weight and thickness of various cardstock used. 110# cardstock mentioned on this forum is usually index and is 199 gsm. 65# cardstock is cover and is 177 gsm.

To help prevent warping when laminating people usually let the lamination dry with a heavy weight like hardcover books on top. Some waxed paper helps prevent the part from attaching to the weight if some glue oozes out.
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Old 02-14-2011, 10:38 AM
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A very nicely done tank. In reference to your paper query you may
find some useful information at this link in the tips and tricks category
Link;what should be the ideal wieght of the paper?

Ron
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Old 02-16-2011, 09:07 AM
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Ron

Thanks for the kind words....

Of course in taking the pictures I made sure the the light was just right so that you could not see the errors....har har har
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Old 02-16-2011, 11:02 PM
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Hi Jerry,

Nice looking tank!

There are many links with all kinds of data to answer your questions. I tried to compile some of the most used cardstock into some PDF.

Here is a link to my thread. Cardstock Property Tables and Terms

The first PDF shows Basis Size and also Thickness table.
The 2nd deals with Equivelant weights of cardstock.
The 3rd will answer your laminate questions.
The 4th was done to find the strongest lightweight of cardstock to use for my airplane models.

Hope they help with most of your questions.

Best regards,
Mike Bauer
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Old 02-16-2011, 11:46 PM
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Thanks Mike,
I consider this the most definitive information regarding
card stock that I've seen. It should be made a sticky as
was suggested previously....Ron
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Old 02-17-2011, 12:23 AM
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Thank Mike:
One great amount of work you have done. This answers my questions and I am very appreciative of your hard work. I agree that this should be a sticky and at the top of the forum.
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Old 02-17-2011, 01:44 AM
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Thank you Ron & Jerry!

I need to update them adding some vellum bristol weights. 67# Bristol is a nice liteweight alternative and easy to find at most office supply stores.

Best regards,
Mike Bauer
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