Why Don't Printers Print The Same Colors?

[mbauer]

Hi Everyone,

Decided to create this thread after reading the build of Airdaves P-47 Lucky. It is a great build thread done by milenio3.

In the thread milenio3 mentions he tried a new type of paper and is not happy with the printed color results. The results are mentioned a few times in the thread by different members.

Dave works very hard to create the correct color for his models. Always experimenting....

His best efforts look different when members do build threads here at PM dot com.

Several things cause these to look different.
1) Type of paper and its Brightness rating
2) How rough the paper is and how it adsorbs the ink (Texture)
3) Converting what is seen on a computer screen (RGB) to CYMK or even sRGB
4) Program used to create PDF
5) Settings used when creating PDF
6) Type of ink (pigment, dye or toner [laser printers])
7) Type of camera used to take the photos. Hi quality lens? Filters used? etc...
8) Lots more factors, but these are the ones we can change the easiest.

Color:
CYMK stands for the ink in our inkjet printers. Cyan, Yellow, Magenta, Black.

RGB stands for Red, Green, Blue (basically-meaning the explanation is rather difficult-to simplify I use the Red, Green, Blue)

One of the best explanations I found for the difference is the following link. It has color illustrations showing the differences:
RGB versus CMYK


Paper / Cardstock:
Many different types of paper. A few types we use for models follow:
1) Bond
2) Copy

3) Vellum
4) Index
5) Cover
6) Tag

The first two are regular printing paper. They might look the same but many differences are available in the two. The last four are types of cardstock, as we already know many differences available here as well.

Texture plays an important in how printed ink looks. Texture effects how the ink is adsorbed, and how it is reflected back to our eyes. Texture is different between manufacturers and their finished paper products.

One common thing they all share and are measured with is a term called "Brightness".

Brightness simple explanation, i.e., All paper is subjected to a test using a specific blue light. The reflection from the paper is measured by a light meter. The reflected "Brightness" is rated with a numbering system. Lower numbers look dull while higher numbers look bright.

Most paper products have a Brightness number somewhere on the package. However, not all manufacturers post it.

When looking at different types of cardstock I have, notice a big difference when laying them side by side.

Brightness rating 86 looks yellow tinted when next to a sheet that is rated 92.

Brightness affects how ink looks on our finished models.

Color conversions between the different ways our printers work also change the way the model will look from one printer to the next.

Lots of factors why our models look different than what the designer intended!

Even if we get a perfect color match, camera used for pictures can change how it looks. This is due to lighting type and quality of camera and lens.

For me, I like checking out build threads to see how everything comes together:

1) Part fit
2) Ease of construction
3) Comments good or bad about instructions
4) Side comments of builders and members reading thread
5) TECHNIQUES everybody builds differently, are there some new tips that can be used
6) Suggestions for improvements
7) Does the finished model look correct

Not to concerned if the "Paint" doesn't quite look right because there are so many different things that can affect the color. If it is close then I'm Happy!

Learned most of this years ago because of a high dollar wide format printer not printing a true black.

No matter what setting used, it will not print black, black. It is more of a greenish tinted black, grays are even more noticeable.

It uses all 6-ink cartridges to create black and it gets really expensive printing SR71 Blackbirds or rocket models that use black.
Did several internet searches, questioned the HP experts and finally found someone who explained that my printer can only print sRGB. Probably explains why the black cartridge lasts the longest!

Please correct me If I've made a mistake on any of the above observations.

Mike

[michael dazzo]

No your right mbauer! I have the same problem here not all my own models are the same as my computer screen color does! and I don't have any idea why??

[ContourCraig]

There are often many questions written about different colors variations from printers, inks, format, etc. But I must comment on the issue of color appearance, even when there is no technical variation present at all.

I was designing a series of historical aircraft (F1AZ's) that I had seen operational many times. I did not like the appearance of painted plastic models on the internet, and after searching numerous real photographs and profiles I selected the one that looked perfect. I took a digital swatch off the 'perfect' photo, and transferred it digitally onto a photo of a plastic model, a model that looked 'terrible'. I was shocked to see the color swatches (rendered through the same software-hardware) were technically identical when toggled between the terrible photo and the perfect one.

If this effect exists between identical samples, then what chance is there for actual variations in any of the print mediums? My conclusion is that differences in color are often due to the human perception system, and therefore technical 'imprecision' or otherwise in paint specifications, printer color modalities and reality is almost irrelevant.

As mbauer says,
"Not to concerned if the "Paint" doesn't quite look right because there are so many different things that can affect the color. If it is close then I'm Happy! "

The closer the better, but do not over-emphasize the technical input, I prefer a very good artistic impression over a technically correct painted one.

[whulsey]

Spend years fighting with color problems when I was in graphics/pre-press. Finally to save my little sanity left went with if the customer is happy, I'm happy. And that is a much more controllable environment then working with digital screens, home printers, etc.

[Dabeer]

Originally Posted by ContourCraig

My conclusion is that differences in color are often due to the human perception system, and therefore technical 'imprecision' or otherwise in paint specifications, printer color modalities and reality is almost irrelevant.

Exactly! Throw in what your brain does when interpreting images, and your results can be all over the map!

The center squares on both top and side are the same color!

[SCEtoAUX]

The center squares on both top and side are the same color!

Yep, did a color picker thang and they are indeed the same color. Ain't the brain neat?

[rmks2000]

Just for laughs I isolated the center square by sticking white paper post-it notes onto the screen and I now see brown.

[Lighter]

Originally Posted by whulsey

Spend years fighting with color problems when I was in graphics/pre-press. Finally to save my little sanity left went with if the customer is happy, I'm happy. And that is a much more controllable environment then working with digital screens, home printers, etc.

Hah! As a customer I learned to tell my printer "Yes sir! That is exactly the color I intended!"

Things have gotten a lot better. I'm ok with my Spyder profiled monitor and carefully following the settings recommended on the sheet included in most packages of photo paper. Nice change from a few years back when surprises were way too common. Of course now I'm retired and only pleasing myself.

[sebastiondarcy]

Many years ago a photo printer friend used to provide a photo copying service. In those days it was done with chemicals and a dark room. To get a copy that the customer was happy with, he would make two copies and throw the original! "Only way - always a happy customer" was his comment.

[Ron Caudillo]

I use CorelDraw to create pages and add color. I learned a long time ago that different printers have different output appearance for the same printed page (a HARD lesson for me).

I now have a PDF of all of the available color swatches of the various color palletes available and print these out on as many printers as I can get to. Then when choosing a specific color, I can do a comparison of what that color looks like from various printers. Then I can choose the one that is best represented from all of these printers. Of course, Mike does make a good point of other factors that will affect color appearance. Thanks Mike and all the others who commented.

I learned when I designed the TOS Enterprise that the color they chose was a concrete greenish-grey; greys tend to look like the color they are placed next to.

Good luck and best regards,