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  #1511  
Old 12-11-2017, 09:24 PM
elliott elliott is offline
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Wow, a lot happening in one post. My sympathies to you on the loss of your friend. Your tribute to him and his modeling skill seems appropriate. Where to from here sir?
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  #1512  
Old 12-15-2017, 04:03 PM
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spacerunner spacerunner is offline
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Thanks elliott for your condolence.

The way I came to know him the last two years, I could imagine that he would be happy for sharing my model with him and in this way would always keep him an honorable memory in our Raumcon Forum, especially as we behind the scenes anyway have worked together closely and constantly exchanged and still had many common plans ...

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  #1513  
Old 12-15-2017, 04:14 PM
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spacerunner spacerunner is offline
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Hello everybody,

in the direct comparison of the two ETs I noticed that the Revell IT is about three millimeters further back than on the Airfix ET, while the lengths and diameters are almost identical.



And because we are comparing the two stack kits, I also looked at the SRBs a bit more closely and also found some differences.



Apart from the smaller number of lower rings, the Revell-SRB appears less filigree than the Airfix SRB, particularly caused by the larger Aft Skirt Hold-down Posts and the sturdier supports on the ET Attachment Ring, although the diameters are comparable.

If one compares the two undersides of the Aft Skirts, one will notice that the ring-shaped heat shield on the Airfix SRB is too narrow-breasted, which Revell has not solve optimally, but at least better,



what the comparison with this picture makes clear, even if it is just a Mock-up on the KSC grounds.


Source: NASA

Probably that has animated my ARC friend Bill (niart17) to 3D-modeling of his Heat shields (1:72).


Source: shapeways.com (niParts)

But neither the heat shield of the Mock-up nor the 3D printing are perfect, as the original consists of 24 segments, as one can see in this drawing.


Source: Space Transportation System - HAER No. TX-116
And so it is also with the kits, no on is perfect, everyone has their advantages and disadvantages.

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Last edited by spacerunner; 12-15-2017 at 04:26 PM.
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  #1514  
Old 12-17-2017, 05:50 PM
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spacerunner spacerunner is offline
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Hello everybody,

now, of course, the question araises, how one could preferably scratch this heat shield, has anyone from the round possibly a useful tip?

Here also still an original photo, whereby these foam insulation under the rings in the early missions did not exist then.


Source: NASA

At first I thought of a suitable ring that one would have to halve, but so far I could not find anything like that.

Or I could try to model such a half ring, e.g. by using Epoxie Sculpt on a circular ring from Sheet.

The easiest way would be for sure if I could motivate Michael Key to model such heat shields in 1/144 for 3D printing, similar as my friend Bill (niart17) made it in 1/72, although I do not necessarily want to overwhelm him with further extra wishes.
So, what else are there for suggestions or ideas?

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  #1515  
Old 12-17-2017, 07:22 PM
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beckychestney beckychestney is offline
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By strange coincidence, I was reading an article today in Trains magazine (January 2018 | Trains Magazine) titled "Route of the Rockets". It was about how from 1988 to 2011 crews from Morton-Thiokol (later Orbital ATK) rode vintage passenger cars behind the trains transporting the booster segments from Corinne, Utah to Titusville, Fla.



The boosters had been shipped by rail since 1981, but in the post-Challenger world the SRB's were subject to scrutiny like never before. Typically 2 Thiokol engineers, a car manager (usually the cars private owner since these cars were not active rolling stock) and a chef rode with the boosters until they were turned over to NASA Railroad at Titusville.



NASA video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUefiFy8p4Q

Anyhoo. In the process of looking that up, I found these:





They made me think about suggesting oven bake clay?
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  #1516  
Old 12-18-2017, 06:06 PM
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spacerunner spacerunner is offline
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Thanks Becky for your interesting comment and the nice photos.

Hello friends,

BTW, after I've measured the SRB in the last photo again more exactly, I still hit on another idea.

Make one out of two!

I also still have a Revell Stack from the kit and could combine its Aft Skirt-Ring, which does not look too bad, with the Airfix Disc.



And I would imagine that the result could well become a useful compromise.

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  #1517  
Old 12-18-2017, 09:48 PM
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dhanners dhanners is offline
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When I built by 1/96th scale shuttle stack, I used embossed paper towels stiffened with a 50-50 mix of water and white glue, then shaped, for the flexible insulation curtain that surrounds the RSRM nozzle. There is also an insulation ring that surrounds the outer edge of the flexible curtain, and I also used strips cut from stiffened paper toweling for that, as well as the blown-on insulation rings on the bottom segment of the RSRM.

The photos aren't the greatest but they give you an idea of what I'm talking about:
Attached Thumbnails
Space Shuttle Launch Pad 39A with Challenger STS-6 (1:144)-img_6132.jpg   Space Shuttle Launch Pad 39A with Challenger STS-6 (1:144)-img_6133.jpg  
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  #1518  
Old 12-19-2017, 04:27 PM
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spacerunner spacerunner is offline
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My compliment David, your heat shields look really great.

I'm always amazed what one can do with paper.

Do you know what kind of material was used for the original shields?

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  #1519  
Old 12-19-2017, 10:51 PM
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dhanners dhanners is offline
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What was technically known as the Aft Skirt Thermal Curtain (ASTC) was a structure of nine layers of woven insulated material that was a little over 2.5 inches thick. The ring around the RSRM nozzle was made up of 24 segments hand-sewn together.

As best I recall, the colors changed during the course of the shuttle's history; I was able to find photos of the Atlantis mission I modeled and the ASTC on its RSRMs was a tan color.

It is dense reading, but here is one technical paper on them: https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/c...9940012651.pdf

And, oddly enough, unused segments show up on eBay from time to time: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Space-Shutt...p2047675.l2557
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  #1520  
Old 12-20-2017, 09:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beckychestney View Post
Anyhoo. In the process of looking that up, I found these:





They made me think about suggesting oven bake clay?
Hi Becky,

first of all thanks for the great article and photos, which are a crucial help for solving one of my last riddles about a strange equipment on the interior walls of the SRB Exhaust Chambers of the MLP.



When looking at the circled detail of this photo, I immediately recalled, because it's strangely wrapped on many photos, as one can see here.


Source: NASA

Here one can detect a little bit more,


Source: NASA

and here one can see it under the SRB Aft Skirt,


Source: NASA

in direct contact with the above circled interface, and both parts are like chalk and cheese.



If I did not have you, Becky!

But nevertheless the question remains, what these equipments were used for?

Maybe dhanners can help?

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