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  #91  
Old 01-17-2018, 03:29 PM
Algebraist Algebraist is offline
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Originally Posted by Richschindler View Post
Looks incredible. An amazing amount of work, but it’s paying off.
Thank for the nice comments. It was a bit of an uphill battle at times (the interstage) but it is a really nice looking bit (I think) and what also kept me going is I clearly remember seeing for the first time the actual separation in flight. It was stunning I thought. Enjoy the video!

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  #92  
Old 01-17-2018, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by dhanners View Post
Looks great!
Thank you.

(Still working on the batting and stringers!)
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  #93  
Old 01-17-2018, 03:56 PM
Algebraist Algebraist is offline
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1/24 thrust structure continued

Dear all

Great news! A break in the weather at the right time meant that I have been able to make the base of the thrust structure former.

I had been thinking about how to make the rocket strong but light. I wanted to only use paper and card (rather than other materials). The only reason for this is I just fancied to see if it could be done and that seed like a fun idea to me. Clearly the rocket need to be strong enough to stand up, but I also thought it best that each stage of the rocket should be able to support itself if held horizontally at each end (so it must not collapse into a "v shape". I wanted to have the actual walls of the model to be an integral part of the structure (rather than them being just a skin on the outside of an already free standing structure (again just for the reason that seemed fun to me). I have done some test and now settled on the method. The trouble is I will only know if it works once the rocket is built and put in that position.

That's just the way it is. I am making composite parts using 7mm double corrugated cardboard. So for the base of the thrust structure I cut two circles and glued them so the corrugations were right angles to each other (to give max strength in all directions. Then on the base added 1.5 mm cardboard

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12036.jpg 1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12037.jpg

This has now been glued to the walls of the thrust structure.

I know this does not seem much but this is a crucial step and "set the path" so to speak.

I'm guessing it the 1/24 that people want to really see, so here is a sequence of photos which I hope you enjoy

First, the Mr Bump mug (seen before in this thread)

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12046.jpg

Next a great 1/144 toy Saturn V

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12048.jpg

It is a "Space Voyagers" Saturn V which we got one of our children many years ago. It has seen loads of action and still looks great and works fine. Sadly the firm no longer exists.

Next stage one of the 1/48 model (just resting on its F-1 engines

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12049.jpg

Finally one more photo

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12051.jpg
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  #94  
Old 01-18-2018, 01:52 AM
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luke strawwalker luke strawwalker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Algebraist View Post
Thank for the nice comments. It was a bit of an uphill battle at times (the interstage) but it is a really nice looking bit (I think) and what also kept me going is I clearly remember seeing for the first time the actual separation in flight. It was stunning I thought. Enjoy the video!

Watching those massive and irreplaceable S-IC stages fall away silently to their inevitable destruction is so sad, particularly now that we see SpaceX landing first stages now pretty much commonplace...

Oh what we could do if only we had the S-IC's back with SpaceX landing capabilities...

Later! OL J R
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  #95  
Old 01-18-2018, 07:56 PM
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beckychestney beckychestney is offline
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I could keep saying WOW! but it might get redundant. But that's what I'm thinking every time you post new pics!
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  #96  
Old 01-20-2018, 08:32 AM
Algebraist Algebraist is offline
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Originally Posted by luke strawwalker View Post
Watching those massive and irreplaceable S-IC stages fall away silently to their inevitable destruction is so sad, particularly now that we see SpaceX landing first stages now pretty much commonplace...

Oh what we could do if only we had the S-IC's back with SpaceX landing capabilities...

Later! OL J R
Hello luke strawwalker

Yes it is quite incredible to see SpaceX's Falcon 9 first stage fly back to the launch pad. In case anyone reading this has not seen it, here is a video (separation happens at 2.45)



Actually, Boeing looked at a number of ways to try and develop a reusable first stage Saturn V. These were mainly parachute into the ocean and then recover. Given that the S-IC is about 6 times more massive that the Falcon 9 v1.1 stage one, it would take a huge mass of fuel to land it the way the Falcon does and currently is not possible. Just shows what a mighty machine the Saturn V was.

I too felt sadness that the S-IC gets destroyed after its brief flight. However I am really pleased that Jeff Bezos (I think) funded the exploration to locate all of the Apollo S-IC's at the bottom of the Atlantic. They have indeed located some of them and NASA (who still owns them) have agreed they can be salvaged provided they are displayed in public museums. One of the F-1 engines from Apollo 12 is now on display at the museum of flight in Seattle (one day hopefully....)






I think there are four Saturn V stage three's still orbit around the sun and pass by the earth occasionally (think they are from Apollo's 8,10,11 and 12 but I might be wrong). I wonder if one day someone will go and recover them. That would be so nice.

Kevin
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  #97  
Old 01-20-2018, 08:48 AM
Gibbo Gibbo is offline
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Hi

Been watching this from the start and must say the work and the history that goes with the build keeps me reading and thinking for some time.
Who need TV with threads like this!!
More please

Rob
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  #98  
Old 01-20-2018, 10:35 AM
Algebraist Algebraist is offline
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difficulties with 1/48 stage two

Dear all

I have been working on the 1/48 stage two and it is giving me a hard time. I am having difficultly with the instructions, the parts matching the instructions and the fit.

So here is what I have done

I decided (from the experience of the stage one to interstage join) that the first thing to get sorted is the interstage to stage two join. Following thee same procedure as that case made the following.

First I cut out the part 1 (x4) of the base skirt and glued them into a ring using part 6 (x4)

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12002.jpg 1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12042.jpg

I then cut out four bits of card (220gsm) to fit inbetween each of the parts six on the inside of the ring (so replacing the need for parts4 (x4) and parts 5 (x4). I added a line 2cm from the top of these bits for guidance when adding part 3 in the future.

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12043.jpg 1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12044.jpg

Next I cut out part 2 (x4) BUT along one long edge left an addition 1cm of card (reason for this is to give some margin for error when fitting the J-2 engines). Then glued to the bottom of the ring, printed side facing in.

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12045.jpg 1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12052.jpg



This is a really precise glue to fit onto the interstage. I found it essential to keep putting it on the interstage after each bit was added. Here it is on top of the interstage

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12061.jpg


Now came the crunch for being able to fit the J-2 engines within the interstage. Despite numerous efforts I just cannot see how this can be done so I decided I would have to alter the depth of the "thrust structure cone" ( that's parts 36,37,38,39). After looking at loads of photos like this

[IMG][/IMG]

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-dsc49647.jpg

(Source: herorelics.org).

To make the J-2 engines fit I calculated I needed to take a 16mm band off parts 36,37,38 and 39). This would give a vertical height of the truncated cone of 50mm. To do this precisely I drew extended edges (of each part) to their intersection, which is a length of 163mm. Using a compass (its over 40 years since I last used one of those!) drew an arc of radius 147 mm. Then I cut out the parts with tabs on as shown

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12053.jpg 1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12054.jpg

Now things got confusing. I noticed that the instructions (page 3 top left hand corner) do not match the parts. The areas marked 40 and 42/43 are interchanged. Looking at the photo the the actual Saturn V, I am pretty sure that on the parts the 40 should be glued where 42/43 is indicated to be glued and visa versa. So with that proviso I glued and got this

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12058.jpg

But now I noticed that although holes had been cut (as indicated on the part) for the LOX and LH2 feed pipes for engine 5, nowhere on the sheet of parts, nor LOX pipes for the other 4 engines.
Looking ahead a bit more I see that there is no outside fairing for the LOX pipes nor is there a part for the LH2 fill/drain connector and fairing, but the intersage has a place for where they overlap. Also I cannot seem to make the measurements of the parts for the cross beam (parts 45-50) line up.

I have re-checked the download and (as far as I can tell) I have downloaded all the parts. It is almost like this is a partial version of stage two.

Checking through the threads I see that gene1772 had a thread Saturn 5 and Saturn 1b in which they build Frederic Bouchar's stage two and show pictures in post#59. It looks very different and looks more like the real Saturn V. Also in the thread by ste4lth Saturn V - 1/48, there is talk about adding to Frederic's stage two (heat shield, fuel pipes etc) for example post #38 by Legal01.

As it stands I think I have three options

Option 1: Design new parts. (Not going to happen as I do not have the talent or knowledge).
Option 2: Find Frederic's original parts, along with parts implied in other threads and combine with parts I have.
Option 3: Just do the best with what I have got.

If anyone could shed light on where I might find the material for option 2, I would be very grateful.
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  #99  
Old 01-20-2018, 10:56 AM
Algebraist Algebraist is offline
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More on 1/24 thrust structure

Dear all

Given the problems I am currently having with the 1/48 model, there has been, thankfully there a break in the hail storms and heavy rainfall for just a few minutes and so I was able to glue the base of the thrust structure of the 1/24 model.

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12056.jpg

It was a bit tense for me. I have got about 20 secs to get from outside to the table and position a 50cm diameter circle to within the thickness of a couple of bits of paper. You cannot "slide" that big of an area, but the 3M super 77 does allow you to peel off and try again once (but only at the very start) if you do not think is is right. I am pleased (actually very relieved) how it turned out.

Next parts cut out ready to fold and glue

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12059.jpg

But first I had to make a "stand" since once the fairings go on I do not think they will withstand the weight. For the 1/48 model I used a test forward skirt capped each end with card. However for the 1/24 model this method would be a major construction and use large amounts of valuable thick card. So instead I made this (and it works fine!)

1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)-sdc12057.jpg

Finally before attaching the above parts I want to make the fairings for the F-1 engines so that I can protect the delicate stanchions straight away. Hopefully very soon i can show you that progress
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  #100  
Old 01-20-2018, 11:02 AM
Algebraist Algebraist is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibbo View Post
Hi

Been watching this from the start and must say the work and the history that goes with the build keeps me reading and thinking for some time.
Who need TV with threads like this!!
More please

Rob
Dear Rob

Thanks for you comments. So pleased you are enjoying the thread. I was a bit reluctant to talk about the Saturn V and the Apollo programme in general since it means so much to me and I can get a little "over enthusiastic"about it and was not sure if people were interested. So I am really pleased that that aspect is enjoyable too

Kevin

Last edited by Algebraist; 01-20-2018 at 11:03 AM. Reason: correction of spelling
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