1/24 Apollo/Saturn V (enlarged 1/48 Greelt et al version)

[peter taft]

Originally Posted by beckychestney

I could keep saying WOW! but it might get redundant. But that's what I'm thinking every time you post new pics!

Me too... it's all incredible

[beckychestney]

Originally Posted by Algebraist

I think there are four Saturn V stage three's still orbit around the sun and pass by the earth occasionally (think they are from Apollo's 8,10,11 and 12 but I might be wrong). I wonder if one day someone will go and recover them. That would be so nice.

Kevin

As a species humanity hasn't really had a good track record at picking up their garbage, sooo....

I was hoping that there would be a worldwide initiative to use the shuttles to do a little orbital housekeeping before they got retired. But that didn't happen either.

[beckychestney]

Originally Posted by beckychestney

I've been searching and searching and haven't found a thing. It was either made of fiberglass or thin sheet metal, possibly aluminum. I used to visit the Visitor's Center 3 or 4 times a year since it's only a couple of miles down the road, but it seems we never saw fit to take a camera!

I found one! I found one!

[luke strawwalker]

Originally Posted by Algebraist

Hello luke strawwalker

Yes it is quite incredible to see SpaceX's Falcon 9 first stage fly back to the launch pad. In case anyone reading this has not seen it, here is a video (separation happens at 2.45)

Yep, amazing images... just love it...

Originally Posted by Algebraist

Actually, Boeing looked at a number of ways to try and develop a reusable first stage Saturn V. These were mainly parachute into the ocean and then recover. Given that the S-IC is about 6 times more massive that the Falcon 9 v1.1 stage one, it would take a huge mass of fuel to land it the way the Falcon does and currently is not possible. Just shows what a mighty machine the Saturn V was.

Originally Posted by Algebraist

I too felt sadness that the S-IC gets destroyed after its brief flight. However I am really pleased that Jeff Bezos (I think) funded the exploration to locate all of the Apollo S-IC's at the bottom of the Atlantic. They have indeed located some of them and NASA (who still owns them) have agreed they can be salvaged provided they are displayed in public museums. One of the F-1 engines from Apollo 12 is now on display at the museum of flight in Seattle (one day hopefully....)

Yep, thanks for mentioning that... I've read a number of the studies for the improvement and possible recovery and reuse of the S-IC stages... From a gigantic helicopter catching it in midair (which IIRC is the plan for the reusable engine pods on some of Falcon 9's upcoming competitors)-- the plan in this case was to snatch the S-IC in midair using a recovery harness and a gigantic helicopter (which of course was never built) to keep it from dropping into the ocean. Another method would have deployed parachutes from the aft end and used a linear shaped charge to blow the oxygen dome off the top of the O2 tank of the S-IC, which would have entered the ocean first at splashdown-- the enormous air volume of the spent LOX tank would act as a giant "cushion" to soften the impact, and then inflatable collars would have held the F-1's up out of the ocean water until the stage was recovered... I guess they considered at least the LOX tank expendable, probably the entire stage was considered expendable, with the F-1's being reused of course... Then during the early days of the shuttle development, they looked at using the S-IC as the first stage for the shuttle, and even did some proposals with adding wings to the S-IC to make it a gigantic flyback booster... Of course none of these plans came to anything...

Yes it would take more fuel due to the extra mass of the S-IC than the Falcon 9 first stage, but it would DEFINITELY be worth it. The problem would be, with F-1's (which were not designed to be "throttleable" and not designed for multiple-in-flight restarts. You have to have a deeply throttleable engine with multiple restart capability to perform the kind of "boost-back" burn, reentry burn, and then landing decelerate to hover/landing (basically entering a "hover" right when it touches the ground you could say) required for return-to-launch-site land landings ala Falcon 9. F-1's would have required major redesign in order to do this, as they were non-throttleable and not designed for an airstart or air-restart, let alone multiple restarts in flight. They were designed for ground ignition. The other option would be to add more, smaller engines designed for multiple-mid-air restarts, deeply throttleable, designed to perform the boost-back burn, the reentry burn, and the landing burn, while (perhaps) supplementing the F-1's thrust during flight (which would improve the S-IC's payload to orbit capability, in fact). BUT, it would greatly increase the stage weight and propellant requirements and complexity, as landing gear would also have to be added, etc.

The actual S-IC, as it existed for Apollo, would probably be a very poor choice for the "return to launch site vertical landing" recovery method ala SpaceX, BUT, if one were purpose-designing a new stage for that role, it could certainly be optimized to perform that function...

Originally Posted by Algebraist

I think there are four Saturn V stage three's still orbit around the sun and pass by the earth occasionally (think they are from Apollo's 8,10,11 and 12 but I might be wrong). I wonder if one day someone will go and recover them. That would be so nice.

Kevin

Yes there's a number of S-IVB's floating around out there... as well as the upper stage of the LM from Apollo 9 or 10 IIRC...

Perhaps in a couple hundred years, if we've become a common spacefaring society, some historians will dispatch "the Enterprise" to go find and tow those Apollo S-IVB's back to Earth... I'm sure the Smithsonian would be glad to have them...

Later! OL J R

[stealth-tech]

Originally Posted by beckychestney

I found one! I found one!

Too bad you didn't have any more pictures. I worked there for some 36+ years and I don't remember what happened to my pictures. I do remember the Saturn V wasn't painted in actual flight colors, but most NASA models were made from conceptual designs. I'm glad they moved most of their exhibits to the Great Lakes Science Center where I think more people will get to see them. Hope you've had a chance to visit one of the rare NASA Glenn open house openings.

[Algebraist]

Originally Posted by beckychestney

I could keep saying WOW! but it might get redundant. But that's what I'm thinking every time you post new pics!

Originally Posted by peter taft

Me too... it's all incredible

Hello Peter and Becky

Thanks for the comments. I'm glad it is "wow". Makes me think I am not letting the designers down. Also I'm glad because the real Saturn V is a wow creation. Glad you are enjoying the build.

Kevin

[Algebraist]

Originally Posted by beckychestney

As a species humanity hasn't really had a good track record at picking up their garbage, sooo....

I was hoping that there would be a worldwide initiative to use the shuttles to do a little orbital housekeeping before they got retired. But that didn't happen either.

Very true but maybe we are starting to change



There is a nice article about the satellite by the BBC in the link below

RemoveDebris

So hopefully the earth wont end up as depicted in WALL-E

[Algebraist]

Originally Posted by beckychestney

I found one! I found one!

Gosh! Even in a photo it looks toweringly impressive. Must have been great to stand next to looking up at it.

I always have to remind myself that in all monster rocket there is only just room for 3 people.

Thanks for hunting down the photo.

Kevin

[beckychestney]

Yeah! And just that tiny little cone at the top was all that was left when it was all over!

PS: That's a recent photo of the V that I found on the net. I'm glad to see it survived and was moved to the Great Lakes Science Center when the VIC closed. But I remember it being painted in the very simple black and white scheme that you see in the old NASA concept sketches rather than the way it's painted now. No idea what became of the other models that stood along side it.

[Algebraist]

Originally Posted by Gibbo

Hi

Been watching this from the start and must say the work and the history that goes with the build keeps me reading and thinking for some time.
Who need TV with threads like this!!
More please

Rob

Hi Rob

Glad you are enjoying the thread.

I too am fascinated by all the stuff people are adding look forward to reading even more

Kevin