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  #21  
Old 03-04-2016, 10:59 AM
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Bluenoser Bluenoser is offline
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I have only seen this image as a low quality and low resolution in the internet. I am aware of it though but was never able to get a copy of it, so I would graciously accept the your offer. I'll PM you.

Another fine book on a Dutch ship model is that of the Valkanisse by Rob Napier.
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  #22  
Old 03-04-2016, 11:38 AM
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The Valkenisse was an early 18th century ship, I believe it was 1717. That makes some difference with later ships, especially the commission given to the English shipwright Bentam in 1742 caused quite a stir. But ten years later much of the old Dutch design was back, because of the complaints that Bentam's ships rolled too much, loaded to little and sank too deep when loaded. Later models show the traditional flat bottom, round bilges and wide hulls. Only the stern stayed round, so Bentam did introduce some change in the Dutch design after all. I made a paper model of that hull last month. And we (my partner Rene Hendrickx and me) made a 3D reconstruction as well.A 17th century Dutch fluit-schermafbeelding-2015-12-09-om-13.20.17.jpg A 17th century Dutch fluit-knipsel-2.jpg
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  #23  
Old 03-04-2016, 11:39 AM
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I think they had three class sizes. in general they were approximately 150' would be the large class, 140' the middle size and 130' the small.
I would love to see a build thread on that one too.
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  #24  
Old 03-09-2016, 05:42 AM
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Here is another update on the building of the Dutch fluit.

I decided to place guns in the steering stand. I made them from paper for the barrels (formed a conic shape and finished it with small strips of paper for the rings) and cardboard for the gun carriages. I use a very nice set of punches to make the wheels and axles. They were bronze 6-pounders. Iron guns would influence the compass, so they were out of the question for this area.
I painted them with brass paint mixed with some green. The carriages were dark-red-brownish. I glued the carriages in place, later the barrels will be inserted through the portholes.
A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01707-large-.jpg A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01710-large-.jpg A 17th century Dutch fluit-schermafbeelding-2016-03-09-om-12.19.46.jpg

The captain's cabin was covered with tarpaulin, all tarred to prevent leakage. Once the upper deck was placed over it, it was impossible to maintain. In the bulkhead was a small window with bars and a slide on the inside to allow the captain to keep an eye on the helmsman. (the term 'captain' is a bit odd here. In Holland the commander of a ship was called `schipper`. A 'captain' usually referred to the commander of a group of soldiers.) The tiller pivoted over de cabin. One would expect to see a whipstaff here, but I never saw a painting or an etching where the helmsman was visible on deck. He was standing in the steering stand, steering on the compass and on the orders of the officer who stood above him on deck, who had a good view forward. The helmsman could see enough of the sails through the small windows in the bulkhead to make small adjustments for better sailing. These windows also allowed light and air into the steering stand. I attached a handle down from the tiller, but probably professor Wegener Sleeswyk was right when he stated that the fluit must have been steered by some pulleys, connecting the tiller with the ship's sides.
A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01712-large-.jpg A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01713-large-.jpg

In this stage I had to take measures for future steps. I made the rudder to add the tiller and after that I made the masts and lined them with small hatches on deck to get the proper rake. The dimensions of the masts were calculated with the old formulae: length of the main mast = twice beam plus depth. 2 x 25 + 12 = 74 feet).
A 17th century Dutch fluit-schermafbeelding-2016-03-09-om-12.20.16.jpg

Then I made the top timbers, which are actually the tops of the frames. They protrude from the sides, lined with ceiling planks and covered with a covering board, which was notched around the top timbers. Of course here the top timbers are glued on top of the covering board. I cut them off just above the top side of the planking and glued a top rail on top of them leaving a small space between planking and rail.

I decided to do most of the details on deck in this stage, because I learned from my previous project that painting the outside has to be one of the last things to do, otherwise the paint will wear off because I usually hold the model between my upper legs when doing the details. Still it is odd to work on details like hatches and steps and a windlass before even the planking of the underside is done. More vulnerable things like knights, pin bars and pumps will be done later. The entrance to the lower deck was a shape I can only make by trial and error. This is only a first try...
A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01715-large-.jpg A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01719-large-.jpg

After all this I can finally finish the outside planking.
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  #25  
Old 03-09-2016, 07:34 AM
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This is very informative. I feel like this is another area where the number of people that know this information is dwindling, so all kinds of speculation comes into play and misinformation is spread.

Sort of like wrought iron. By education, I'm a materials science guy. Wrought iron was so common, that no one wrote about how it was produced. Now no one knows, and a form of cast iron is often called wrought iron today, even though on a microscopic scale the new wrought iron looks nothing like true wrought iron.

Occasionally I read about people building replica ships. Do you ever work with those folks?
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  #26  
Old 03-09-2016, 09:58 AM
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abhovi abhovi is offline
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I hope it is informative indeed, because as I previously wrote, I have always built with original methods and materials. What I do now is new to me. Because of my study of old books together with the knowledge I gathered by building in the original way I was involved with the replica of the Duyfken in Australia (Duyfken 1606 Replica Foundation), the Utrecht Statenjacht (Unieke locatie voor trouwfeest, bedrijfsuitje, receptie of bijzondere vergadering) and I made the new design for the 7 Provincien in Lelystad (bataviawerf.nl). I was also involved in more replica building projects in a lesser role.

But the same as your wrought iron, it is knowledge that is scarce.

To do something about that, by summer we will present a 3D reconstruction of the pinas I built in the previous thread, which will be placed on the site of the governmental service for cultural heritage (RCE). We are working on a method to make it possible that the visitor is able to navigate through the ship, pointing out parts of the construction, getting information on that part (both in Dutch and in English) and on a short film to show how a Dutch ship of that era was built.

I will keep you informed.
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  #27  
Old 03-09-2016, 10:15 AM
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Michael Mash Michael Mash is offline
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It is a pleasure watching your project.
The last three images show it nicely.
Mike
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  #28  
Old 03-09-2016, 10:23 AM
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Yale Yale is offline
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Castles, too?

Quote:
Originally Posted by abhovi View Post
.... by summer we will present a 3D reconstruction of the pinas I built in the previous thread, which will be placed on the site of the governmental service for cultural heritage (RCE). We are working on a method to make it possible that the visitor is able to navigate through the ship, pointing out parts of the construction, getting information on that part (both in Dutch and in English) and on a short film to show how a Dutch ship of that era was built. ...
Such a computer tour of the ship would be absolutely wonderful. For a very long time, I've wished for similar tours of the Loire chateaux and other great castles/palaces, but the production economics must not be favorable.
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  #29  
Old 03-13-2016, 06:58 AM
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abhovi abhovi is offline
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Some progress with the fluit.

I planked the underwater hull with strips of .5 mm cardboard. It is a blessing to have a 3D model of the ship so all strakes can be printed to scale and cut out. They made a perfect fit. In reality every strake is of course devided into several planks, which makes even the more extreme curvetures possible. But as you can see there are no extreme shapes to plank this fluit with its well bent lines.


A 17th century Dutch fluit-schermafbeelding-2016-03-12-om-10.42.21.jpg

I also tried to finish the masts. They are much shorter than the ones on the pinas, due to the narrow shape of the ship.

A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01723-large-.jpg

To finish the planking I had to use polyester filler, which needed some sanding. I noticed that the distance between the frames was too much for the bottom, which caused a peculiar, but not unelegant pattern. Nevertheless the bottom is nice and flat. For my next ship I will insert more frames on the lower part.

A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01730-large-.jpg A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01731-large-.jpg

Next job was to cover all the cardboard with plastic strips of white self adhesive material with a wood imprint. The colored sorts (oak, cherry, fir) were not to my liking so I have to do it with white.

Once finished with that it was possible to mark the waterline. For 17th century ships the ‘white stuff’ (a mixture of animal fat, resin and sulpher) against growth of algea and shells was always applied up to the middle of the lower wale. The fluit has three wales, in which case the lowermost one did not count. Together with a 2% deeper in the stern (to allow for better steering) I had enough information to draw the water line.

A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01729-large-.jpg A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01732-large-.jpg

The characteristic lines of the fluit become evident.

A 17th century Dutch fluit-dsc01734-large-.jpg

See you next time.
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  #30  
Old 03-13-2016, 08:02 AM
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Michael Mash Michael Mash is offline
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Nice work.
This process resembles the method used by the wood modelers.
Mike
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