Question - Early Luftwaffe markings

[rockpaperscissor]

I plan on building the Saba Models Fi 158, but I want to recolor it to match the only photo I've seen that shows any markings on this prototype airplane - a port side D-EAEN in black, and an early style swastika on the vert stab (black swastika in white circle, probably on a red band). So, here are my questions: 1. Same marking on the starboard side? 2: Wing markings. Is it safe to assume D-E on top port wing and AEN on top starboard wing? Top only? Reversed on bottom? Bottom only? Both? 3. Other than the swastika, any other luftwaffe markings - crosses, etc? Any help would be very much appreciated since my internet searches have led to nothing.

[rockpaperscissor]

So, from poking around a bit at the Wings Palette site, I saw other aircraft from the period that had fuselage side markings only. So I will put D-EAEN on each side, and a swastika on a white circle on a red band on the outside of each vertical stabilizer. The wings will have no markings of any kind. Overall color will be mid grey.

[airdave]

sorry, but the last place you should be getting your information from is Wings palette.
...not just because it is a flat out piracy site, but because it is mainly just pirated artist profile artworks.

With all respect to some great artists out there, there are way too many profile artists producing
way too many inaccurate artworks.
In most cases, information is just copied from previous artworks
...kind of like copies of copies of copies, with each one getting further away from the truth! lol

I'm no expert on WW1 planes, so I'm not offering you anything constructive in that regard...I am sorry about that
...but the internet is a big place with access to a lot of information.
Modellers sites and Forums abound, as well as Aircraft and Military History websites.

I get research info from dozens of different sites and discussion groups with every new project.

So, even though you may have gotten lucky and are looking at some accurate pics, its still worth the effort to search for more.

[rockpaperscissor]

Unfortunately, photos of the Fi 158 are few and far between. Most show just a plain grey airplane with no markings at all. One does show a side view with the markings I've outlined above. If there were wing markings, they aren't visible in the photo. I went to Wings Palette as a last resort cuz I was itching to do some Photoshop work. It's easy enough to change what I've done if I do eventually get definitive info.

[airdave]

I get a lot of good info from dedicated forums about each subject.

Researching the Centurion Tank has got me to some very interesting people and places.
Another good source is the people who work for various Museums.
I have contacted people who curate and those who have written books about related subjects,
they usually have lots of unpublished info.

Not sure how important this project is, I might be overthinking this for you.
Don't mean to pile extra on to this project, but I have come to respect the
research and fact finding that goes into each new project.
It can be very very frustrating...as well as fun and interesting (I know!).

[scissorsandplanes]

Hi Don.
Given the design period of he airplna (1938) is close to that of h bf109 and based on pictures of the V1 and V4 prototypes of the latter in the marvelous book "famous fighters of world war two" by Wiliam Green I would say that the markings are as follows:
D-CODE on both sides of the fuselage and on top and bottom of wing (readable when nose of aircraft isnpointing up). The ones on ghe fsdlage being cut as D-C and ODE
And the swastika (in the right sense) in a red band on the tail.
So you were right from the beginning

S&P

[rockpaperscissor]

It's not a super important project, Dave. I just had some time to kill, and was pretty sure that the markings on the "stock" kit are incorrect. It'll be something I'll build at some point, but it's not number 1 on the to do list. Best of all, it gave me another chance to play around with Photoshop.

Thanks S&P, I wasn't 100% sure since this was a one of a kind prototype airframe. Most photos show no markings at all, and as I said, the shot that shows fuselage markings has obscured wings. I suppose it's possible that none, some, or all of the usual markings could have been on the plane at any given time. Anyway, it's been Photoshopped with the full monty. I'm going to do a draft print and quick tape assemble to make sure everything lines up before I do any further enhancements.

[matt77]

Here, in Italy, in the forums dedicated to the historical model, people of three generations after, quarreling about the color of the interior of the aircraft, land for speculation very personal. they claim that that color was the color of X, and only the color X .

Then find out, the worker who worked on the painting, which when he finished the X color of firm BrothersX , was mixed with the color Y of the company SistersY.

Therefore, the only true source are the photographs, which unfortunately are in black and white.
Who knows you can not remember .... I have had since I drive the car, a around twenty cars, but who remembers the upholstery of the second to last?

I saw P.51 rebuilt, polished like washing machines, as never would have come from the factory, as if they were built by a jeweler, and scale models of aircraft with a weathering than twenty years of war, who instead fought for two years maximum ...

The modelism is essentially a hobby, to rebuild a scale model you can use certain data or logical deductions (personal) used sparingly...

I saw the same scalemodel of Fi.158 colored beige or warm gray or gray-blue or sage green, always RLM 76!
What may have used the color-Gerhard Fieseler-Werke GmbH to color a single unit in the late thirties?

Jerry Crandall of Eagle Editions shared some of his insights about RLM standards and their variations in the field, and while the differences didn't show up much in the darker colors, some of the lighter colors definitely showed them off loud and clear, most notably RLM 76. You'll see the undersides of many German aircraft carrying everything from light blue, light gray, and even grey-green as their version of RLM 76. Which one is correct?

In the papermodel in question, it was hypothesized an hypothetical operating theater, adding insigina and numer-werk.

There are pictures of the same with registration and swastika on the rudder, without registration and without swastika, in any case I do not see Balkan crosses.

The swastika in a white circle, is not perceived color difference between the fuselage and rudders, so would exclude the color red.

This is what I see,

regards, matt77

[rockpaperscissor]

Thank you for your input, mat77. I think we're looking at the same photo. I agree that there isn't any clear evidence of the red band, but my thought was that, assuming there was a band, it might be all but invisible against the mid grey fuselage in that old grainy black and white photo. I concluded that there was probably a red band only because that seems to be the most common style of insignia in German aircraft of the period. Plus, it adds a spot of color to what's going to be a pretty dull model.

I agree that the discussion on correct coloring can be a bit over the top. Frequently, "standard" colors are/were anything but standard. We used to have similar discussions in the military miniature world, but I think that wide variations were probably the norm there due to the natural dyes used, and the affects of weather, and time in the field. I imagine that many British "Redcoats" could just have accurately been called Pinkcoats, or Browncoats.

[Papercaptain]

Hello, Don!
From your description of the plane I reckon, that it's an early factory production or prototype still having civil registration - so no Luftwaffe markings. The red band with a white circle and a black swastika in it was used by all civil german aircraft after 1933 on the port side (on the starboard were the earlier stripes black white red) / but since Sept. 1934 at the latest on both sides of the vertical fin (Seitenleitwerk).
Civil registration marks were used for prototypes as long as they were owned tested or flown by the factories, but only until 1942, when all aircraft got military markings.
The system as from March 1934: D stands for Deutschland = Germany, E means Einmotorig = single engine, up to 1000 kg, the last 3 letters are the "proper ID" of the plane. They were on both of the fuselage sides. I'm not sure, if they were on both wings at that time. Normally they were like yours D-E // EAN.
Kind regards
Papercaptain