Selling on eBay and other ill fitting shoes.

[airdave]

Selling on eBay...it just doesn't fit well any more.

I've got some (maybe) helpful info to share.
Get a coffee and sit back, this is a lengthy post.

1. The first thing is about a seller on eBay selling unauthorised items.
In this case, digital paper model kits, that the seller has no permission to resell.

This particular Maldovian seller has a large collection of paper model kits for sale.
They include aircraft, vehicles, space and more.
Some are originally printed/published models and many are digital(online) only.
The pre-printed kits are obviously scanned and reproduced into digital files.

The seller is selling printed kits, printed from the digital files.
But I have no idea of the quality of the scans or digital files, or of the print quality.
This should be the first concern for any buyer.
I also have no idea if there are any cropped or missing sheets.

Many of the kits he sells were originally free-to-download, like Uhu's and Paper-replika.
And as I mentioned, he would have no rights or permissions to reproduce and/or sell these models.

One of the kits he was selling, was an Aaron Murphy digital kit (Murph's Models).
Aaron's IXS Enterprise spacecraft.
However, the photos of the built model were photos stolen from here, my photos.
Photos of the IXS Enterprise I built as a commission, and not exactly Murph's model.
It is misleading to show my model as Murph's.

While I can't say much about this guy selling Murph's model, I still complained in a private message thru ebay.
I told him to remove my photos from the listing.
I pointed out the photos were not of the correct model and that he also did not have permission to sell the kit.
I called him a thief. Twice.

Anyway, it seems he complied...and not only removed my photos, but the entire listing.
He sent me a message saying he would do this because I requested it.
He also claimed that he bought the model from a friend and decided to resell it.
(This of course is a ridiculous lie)

I wish I had the time or energy to contact him about every model he sells.
I did tell him that I personally knew all the designers of all the models he has pirated,
and that I would be reporting his listings to them all.

Unfortunately, its those designers who must do the contacting and demanding.
And in many cases, these 'thieves' will respond and take action.
So its worth it to try.

..................
The second issue is regarding sales on eBay.
I've been away from eBay for a number of years and just this past month, decided to give it a try again.
For anyone thinking of selling anything on ebay, heres some important info.

I stopped using eBay a few years back as their fees began to increase.
Now, fees sit about 13.25%.
Sure, listings are free...but final value fees are a bit over the top.
Its a hefty chunk of your profit when you sell something.

But it gets worse, read on...

When I returned to eBay last month, I found out that Paypal was no longer accepted.
In fact there are no other payment options other than having a major credit card on file with ebay.
And if you are a seller, you have to directly link a bank account.

This is where I panicked.
Seller's payouts from sales go directly into a bank account.
So not only do you have to give eBay access to a personal bank account,
they also get permission to withdraw from that account (in the case of owed fees, etc).

Ebay is not known for their online security...there have been issues in the past.
Even the biggest and most secure sites get hacked weekly.
On top of it all, now eBay has direct bank account access information for their users.

It gets even worse...
I also found out that payouts don't get delivered until after you ship an item.
1-3 days after they receive confirmation of shipping (and possibly delivery).
That means you are restricted to shipping methods that include tracking and related info.

This also means that a buyer could change their mind and request a refund after you have shipped an item.
Not only do you not get paid, the item is gone and may never be returned.
(I read about this exact scenario from a reddit user)

This is where I said no to coming back to eBay.

But a couple of weeks later I had to rethink things.
I have some items that I have been trying to sell, and eBay is a good market for them.
I have my best chances of selling there.

So, I contacted a new bank...not my own personal bank...opened a new account.
A free chequing account that didn't require a balance.
Its to be used only for eBay, with the only funds going in or out being the sales amounts.
I can eTransfer the payouts out of the account as soon as they appear (to my real bank).
And if anyone ever gets my eBay info, they only get the info to this empty bank account.

And so, this past week, I listed a dozen items and then made my first sale.

And this may be my last sale on ebay.

You see, this is when I get my first look at how sales work and how I get ripped off.

Lets start with the selling price.
I want to get at least $60 for my item.
Items like this one have easily sold for well over $100.
So I auction list it for $60.
I know that ebay fees will eat into that, which forces you to raise the starting price.
But raising the price can scare potential bidders away.
So, instead I add a Buy It Now option of $80.
(I should have just bumped up the auction start price to $80)

Of course, someone grabbed the Buy It Now price right away.
Even $80 is a good deal for this item.
I'm a bit disappointed, but at least I have a cushion against ebay fees, right?

I charged $10 for shipping which more than covered it. (about $1 over)

When I finally got my payout...after I had shipped...after it arrived...after the buyer had left feedback!
My payout was $66.
Wow...$14 to ebay? on a $80 sale? thats kind of too much, right?

So I looked into the breakdown of fees.
Seems ebay now charges the buyer Sales Tax (on used resale items?)
And eBay charges fees to the seller on that Sales Tax...along with the shipping cost.

So ebay makes money off stuff that the seller has no hand in, but pays anyway.
Shipping and Sales Tax are above and beyond the sale and out of everyone's control and I don't make any profits off.
But ebay does.
They charge their final value fee on everything that the buyer has to pay.

I sold an item for $80 plus $10 shipping plus sales tax.
The buyer had to pay $110.
And I had to pay ebay fees, 13.25% of $110...not the $80 I sold the item for.

So now, we're back to jacking up the price of items to cover the extra costs that eBay will charge you.
For example, I have an item selling on facebook and kijiji for $600 right now.
And its also listed on ebay...for $800.
lol the same item is on ebay for $200 more just to cover what I will lose if it sells there!

...............................
I've been thinking of listing some prebuilt kits on ebay.
(I need to get rid of a lot of stuff before I pack up and move, which is getting closer every day)
But I will be forced to jack up prices to guaranty some sort of reasonable profit,
making the models less attractive to potential buyers.
So, I may not be able to sell them this way.

Selling on eBay is an option and maybe one you've considered for something similar,
just remember its a cut throat market now where sellers out number buyers 10 to 1.
That should work in your favour, but it doesn't.

And ebay's new rules and pricing, make it a less than enjoyable experience.

My suggestions?
Think about creating a separate bank account just for ebay sales.
Make it a completely new Bank, separate from your personal banking.
Don't keep extra money in it.
Be prepared for the day when ebay reveals it was hacked (again) and your account info is out there.
(you can just close the account and open a new one)

Remember ebay fees.
Calculate the minimum price you must have for an item and consider marking it up at least 20%.
Use the increased price for your auction starting price and/or buy-it-now price.
This was you will at least cover ebay fees without losing any sales profit.

Document your shipping.
When you are directed to ship your item before you've been paid, photograph the shipping parcel before it goes.
Use a shipping method that tracks your parcel and make sure you keep all related receipts and shipping documents.
Take photos of those documents so you can provide them to ebay.
Take a photo at the post office of your parcel being received by them.
Get signatures and names at the post office (don't use mail boxes to post mail).
Anything that you can use at a later time to prove you shipped and if necessary, track the parcel to get it back.

[RyanShort1]

Ebay is still a big market, which is why I still sell stuff there. As you pointed out, however, you've got to figure out how much they're taking from you in the process.

[mbauer]

Been ripped off too many times by sellers that don't ship.

Trying to collect the money back? Didn't work.

I closed my account two years ago and have not been back.

They are a rip off organization that has no protection for your money.

Mike

[RyanShort1]

Originally Posted by mbauer

They are a rip off organization that has no protection for your money.

That's not true. I've got a good rating and have been able to defend myself against people trying to cheat several times. It's in their best interest to keep their customers happy.

https://www.ebay.com/usr/doolittleraid

[ReynoldsSlumber]

Thanks for this report.
It's part of how so many companies at first offered something nice in order to get big and then, once they have that large user base, put on the squeeze.

[airdave]

Originally Posted by ReynoldsSlumber

Thanks for this report.
It's part of how so many companies at first offered something nice in order to get big and then, once they have that large user base, put on the squeeze.

In reality, its called "taking advantage".

But like you said earlier, ebay still reaches a lot more people, and around the world.
The local market is great for some things, but when you need to reach collectors and hobbyists, you need to reach a lot further.

[juan angel 747]

if the situation with Ebay is terrible They don't want to imagine the situation with "mercado libre" a man is selling the PDF files of models and recolors that an Argentine friend named Diego Pucara made, not to be confused with Tex Diago

We really haven't been able to do anything to close his sales, yet in all the Facebook groups we try to warn everyone not to buy from that guy.

[airdave]

The owner/author of the models (not his friends) can register at ebay, and then report a seller.
He must provide proof that there is copyright infringement.
This means filling out some information (name, address, phone, etc) and making a declaration.
And he will have to provide proof of ownership.
In my case, I always point to my web site or webpages where my products are available legally.
If you can't do that, then send a copy of the file, or an image that shows authorship.
Even just one or two pages of a model that shows the author/owner's ID.

I did a search on ebay for seller "mercado libre".
No such seller there.
So, where is he selling?

if he is selling on facebook, the same rules apply.
The original author/owner can report to facebook and file an IP complaint.
He will still have to give personal info and prove the property is his.
Once again, his friends cannot do this for him.

[juan angel 747]

Mercado Libre is an online store similar to Ebay but that operates in Latin America.

And the worst of all is that there is no way to report the guy who sells through that online store since the systems are very poor.

Papercraft Aviones Malvinas Vectorial Superior | MercadoLibre

[mbauer]

Originally Posted by mbauer

They are a rip off organization that has no protection for your money.
Mike

Originally Posted by RyanShort1

That's not true. I've got a good rating and have been able to defend myself against people trying to cheat several times. It's in their best interest to keep their customers happy.

https://www.ebay.com/usr/doolittleraid

This is very true.

I was a member from 1996 thru 2022. I had a 100% ratings as a seller and Buyer.

Case in point, bought a Video card, card came shipped in a bubble pack, no box, just a bubble pack: it was bent up beyond use. $400 price tag.

I contacted the seller, he didn't want to return it, but eventually after a claim he did. I was never refunded the money although I could show them a return signature needed from the postal service. I had to pay for the return shipping because the shipping label provided from eBay did not cover the correct cost of return from Alaska.

He said I sent some other piece of junk back. Case closed.

Then I bought some ink cartridges for my wide format printer, seller had 3-boxes of each color for $160. What I received was glued back together HP Original ink boxes with empty ink cartridges.

ebay did nothing for my claim.

Then I bought a small stadium chair from a low review seller, he showed the process of shipping, but nothing ever shipped. ebay soon removed this guy as a seller, was never able to get my money back, although this seller was removed for doing the same trick to other buyers.

These are only a few examples for why I had my account closed. Granted the first years until about 2018 were good deals, the last few years are why I closed my account and the prices for most items are now comparable to Amazon with free shipping, and warranties.

Mike