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  #31  
Old 03-24-2023, 04:07 PM
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CharlieC CharlieC is offline
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I don't think the Barbastro creators had much of an issue about routing the exhaust pipes. The Ford side-valve V8 didn't really have exhaust manifolds - just pipes which ran along the lower side of the cylinder banks. Even plumbing in a pair of radiators wouldn't have been difficult since the V8 had coolant header pipes from the top of each cylinder bank.

Charlie
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Barbastro tank SCW-flathead_ford.jpg  
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  #32  
Old 03-24-2023, 06:02 PM
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Dang, I thought I had something there, but your arguments make sense. Thanks for your comment, SmashedGlass. Yes Tappi, the Minairons tank is all wrong per the rearview photo. The rear hull definitely had a shallow peak that ran all the way to the back, whereas their model is completely flat. The Panzer Garage kit is better, I think. Whether there were removable grates over the engine compartment is pure conjecture, but it's certainly easier to model it that way. The final version of this model will feature the two mysterious bumps. I just have to decide on their shape: flat topped, peaked, curved? I'll see if I can find some additional information using a different search engine. Perhaps yandex.com will provide data from a few alternate sources.
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  #33  
Old 03-26-2023, 12:13 PM
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The development of the basic B&W suspension is complete.

The first photo is of the enlarged jpeg that I drew the basic shape of the suspension over. To do this I first created a new blank layer. Thus, the lines that I drew were on this layer, and not on the photo itself. Next, I created a new blank Photoshop page and, using the mouse with left click depressed, dragged the layer over onto it. If you go back to the beginning of the thread and open the development1 pdf file, you can see the 3 outline drawings that I used as the basis of the entire design.

Using the 3/4 rear view photo as a reference I came up with a track width that I thought looked about right and separated the outside/inside suspension halves by that amount and then drew in the strip that will later support the track itself. I didn't know how much length I needed, so I just drew the strip to the very edge of the 8.5'x11" page. I mirrored the completed part for the other side.

The second photo shows the basic right-side suspension part. I had already drawn on all the glue tabs using the Photoshop line tool.

The third photo shows the alpha build of the hull and left-side suspension part along with the right-side suspension drawing. The printable area is smaller than the full page, so I lost an unknown bit of length on each end of the track strip, but the two ends still overlapped by about a quarter of an inch.

The remainder of the photos shows the alpha build of the suspension glued onto the alpha build of the hull. I'm very happy with the way it looks.

Next, I'll generate layering parts for the suspension, and fill all the suspension parts with texture, highlights and shadows as previously explained. Also, I need to look for images of tractor or bulldozer tracks that I can modify to fit over the track support strip. If that doesn't work out, I can draw and texture my own tracks if necessary.
Attached Thumbnails
Barbastro tank SCW-suspension-development.jpg   Barbastro tank SCW-build26.jpg   Barbastro tank SCW-build27.jpg   Barbastro tank SCW-build28.jpg   Barbastro tank SCW-build29.jpg  

Barbastro tank SCW-build30.jpg  
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  #34  
Old 03-26-2023, 05:24 PM
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Fascinating to watch the design process!

Don
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  #35  
Old 03-26-2023, 05:48 PM
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They might have used or copied tracks from existing armoured vehicles being made in Spain at the time. The city of Barbastro is about midway between Bilbao and Barcelona where the Trubia Naval tank and Benach Armoured (thing) were being built. The Trubia track was, I think, a modified Orion track system but the Benach track looks like a fairly generic track of the period. There's even a surviving Benach OP tractor (base for the armoured things) in Spain.

Charlie
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Barbastro tank SCW-trubia_17.jpg   Barbastro tank SCW-benach_op_tractor.jpg  

Last edited by CharlieC; 03-26-2023 at 06:04 PM.
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  #36  
Old 03-27-2023, 10:26 AM
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Tapcho Tapcho is offline
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Coming along nicely and a pleasure to follow. One notion if allowed: if I were to design this tank (the original) I would have given it a little better angle in the bottom to meet obstacles more favourably. Maybe even climb over them. :-) But I'm not an expert on these issues so I leave it up to you.

Tappi
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Barbastro tank SCW-build29.jpg  
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  #37  
Old 03-30-2023, 05:52 PM
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Great image of the Benach tractor, Charlie. I've recolored and built a couple of the Tiznaos based on that tractor (downloads available at landships II). I couldn't find a good photo at the time I built them or I would have made a few changes. You may well be right, Tappi. It's such a weirdly shaped suspension, I don't know how it would have affected the hull shape. Both resin kits appear to have quite a bit of frontal ground clearance, but there's also a multimedia scratch-built model with a rounded hull in the front that has similar ground clearance to my rendition.

Anyway, I'm very happy with the way the suspension looks. I think I've captured the sharp angle of the front idler pretty closely. There are a couple of very nice illustrations of the Barbastro tank online but to my eye the angle is too shallow. I think the most distinctive feature of this tank should be accurately represented.

I wound up designing an original track strip for the model. First, I drew an initial track link and connector. Then I made a copy of the link/connector and moved it into position to make a two-link strip. I flattened that image and then made a copy of both links/connectors, and moved the copy into position, making a four-link strip. Flattened the image again, and copied again to yield an eight-link strip, etc. etc.

I already know that I can't make a strip long enough on letter sized paper to completely wrap the suspension, so I copied the completed strip a couple of more times. Filler pieces are intended to be cut from the third track strip. I found a nice free downloadable rusty sheet metal image online and copied it. Then I selected the track strips and used the "paste into" feature to fill the tracks with texture. For added detail I made up a strip of cleats that are to be cut up and glued to the track after it's been wrapped around the suspension. For my model, I glued the track strip to 0.5mm cardboard. The cleats were doubled.

After scoring and bending all the glue tabs, I reinforced the inside of the suspension with thin corrugated cardboard. I placed a few heavy books on top so it would remain perfectly flat while drying. When dry, I glued all the layering pieces (previously affixed to Raisin Bran cereal box cardboard) onto the front side of the suspension. Final assembly was easy peasy - just wrap the base strip around the sides, gluing as you go.

The track strip has score marks indicated which will facilitate mounting it to the suspension assembly. After making all the bends and pre-shaping the track I ran a bead of glue all along the inside of it, and then glued it into place. The filler piece is then cut to size and glued onto the bottom side of the track where it will be less noticeable.

Tonight I'll start gluing on all the cleats and will post more photos tomorrow. We're almost at the finish line.
Attached Thumbnails
Barbastro tank SCW-build31.jpg   Barbastro tank SCW-build32.jpg   Barbastro tank SCW-build33.jpg   Barbastro tank SCW-development6.jpg   Barbastro tank SCW-development7.jpg  

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I don't always build models, but when I do... I prefer paper. Keep your scissors sharp, my friends.
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  #38  
Old 03-31-2023, 01:14 AM
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Tapcho Tapcho is offline
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Those tracks look really nice.

Tappi
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  #39  
Old 03-31-2023, 04:09 PM
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CharlieC CharlieC is offline
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If you compare the front of track frame of the Barbastro tank to any one of the British WW1 rhomboid tanks the angles and proportions are quite similar. I think the builders of the tank were trying to achieve the same performance over obstacles as the WW1 British tank. It seems to me - rather than setting the driving sprocket low down in the rear and taking the track over a set of rollers as the British tank did, to form the rhomboid shape, they simply had a straight line from the idler at the front to the drive sprocket at the rear. It looks odd but certainly gets the front idler high enough to climb over most obstacles.

(Image is "Mother" - the first rhomboid)

Charlie
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Barbastro tank SCW-mk_i_iii_1.jpg  
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  #40  
Old 04-01-2023, 01:33 AM
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thats looking great well done sir
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