Unfold Brazil

[rickstef]

Hi all,

I have been following this designer for some time now, he has created a nice selection of Marvel Universe characters
Burning Beard's excellent Captain America as an example.

you can visit his site here
https://unfoldbrazil.wixsite.com/unfoldbrazil

and for those of you who also inhabit the Facebook realm, you help him release his version of the Hulkbuster Iron Man armor by simply liking his page, only need a few more likes to reach 2500, at which time he will release the kit




Just a couple of pictures to whet your appetite.

If you are interested in the kit, and are on Facebook, visit Unfold Brazil here
https://www.facebook.com/unfoldshouse/

Rick

[airdave]

Please don't call him a "designer".
Its an insult to Uhu, Marek, Nobi, Murphy, and many many others... including myself...who actually "design".

I'll agree, they are nice looking built models...I'd love to build a big scale Batman or Ironman.

But he did nothing more than import a 3D model file with textures (that he didn't create)
into Pepakura (a software he also didn't create)
and produced an unfolded paper model pattern ready to build.

I don't know where he gets the 3D models...maybe ripped from one of the many copyrighted Marvel Games
(someone else's copyrighted artwork)

...or maybe from deviant-art or another similar spot for sharing 3D cad files.

And the finished paper models usually don't come with any sort of Instructions or assembly diagram,
since the "designers" usually don't have the time, ability or desire to create any.

[climbing down from my soapbox now...]

[rickstef]

Thank you for your time Dave

[Mike1158]

Just as a side issue, would he be required to pay royalties, even for free items? To the license holders.

[rickstef]

this probably falls in the category derived fan art, if every company would be going over every piece of art or hobby related item, then all hobbies where something is based off of something else, will in essence collapse.
No models, no cosplay, no drawings to learn how to create comics, all creativity would be subject to licence fees.

[airdave]

Even a free model can hurt profits.
If Marvel were to sell the rights to a card model company, to produce figure models,
they would be forced to go after and stop those who produce and share free models like this.
Its only fair to protect their franchisees and investors...and those who actually pay royalties.

But I agree with Rick.
I think all these companies try their best to keep tabs on how their ideas are reused,
but most realize tolerance for "fan-art" only results in better feedback and appreciation.
Not to mention some free advertising.

Never ignore the bigger picture.

But, the "designer" must still respect where and how they get inspiration and material.
And give credit, where credit is due.

[ShadowCory]

To be fair, it is "Unfold Brazil", not "Design Brazil" (dad joke, as my kids would say)
Just curious, is all of this information something you know, Dave? I do see your point, it just sounded like you had inside info or something.
A peek at some of the meshes reveals all of the characters have the same basic triangle or poly layout, just massaged into the different shapes. That indicates to me that they all originate from a single source. They do exhibit the mid poly count hands used in game characters. Thumb, index finger, mitten the remaining. Lowest poly would have a mitten, with just a separate thumb, and the "hero" and regular level would have all five digits modeled. which comes across odd to me, on a large scale model.
I don't even know why I am chiming in. Just an observation from someone with game modeling experience, I suppose. Or maybe I feel a little put down because I use a 3d program to make at least 50% or more of my own "designs". Although I can say I build the digital model and do the painting myself.

[bigpetr]

Hello gyus, I just want share my personal opinion ot this .

I do not see why caling him designer shoud insult other designers.
Pepakura do not do its thing in one click of a button. It takes some work (sometimes lot of work) to think of how the model will be structured and then rearange by hand Pepakura initial automatic sollution. This could be called designing in my eyes.

I understand others (me included) incorporate more intrique and complex design proces. This is just simplier and faster, but still, designing.

Maybe he did not make his 3d models, but he surely edits it for paper modeling purposes and arange them to their poses. If he has this 3d models at his hand why waste the time and model it again?

No, he did not create Pepakura. But nowdays designers uses all kinds of CAD and texturing software they did not create. So I do not know why this should make him lesser designer if he uses such a tool too.

Absence of instruction can be problem sometimes. But generaly no instructions needed for pepakura files. You open them in pepakura viewer where you can see what goes where. Only thing missing is information on what to do first and what to do next and it can complicate things.

As for rights I also see it as derived thing. He does not make money on this, He even do not have adds on his site. As long as he does not hurt royalties paid business. Give credits is a must in my opinion.

I do not like Pepakura models that much, and I do not like paper figures that much (too boxy and not realistic enought for me - only exception is busoramas - amazing paper figures Papermodel Pilots )

But I am glad this designer is doing this figures for us. I made a few for kids with great success.

Thank you for reading my post this far

[airdave]

Stealing is stealing.
If a truck distributing free water bottles is hijacked and all the water taken,
and then redistributed in a different area
...its still theft of water bottles from the original owners!

Free or not, you are using someone else's designs, artwork and property.

Derived? Tell that to Disney.
Tell them you "derived" the idea of a product from a Mouse named Mickey.
But because you changed Mickey's outfit colours
and did not accept any money for the products you give away,
its okay for you to use their designs.
Go ahead...try that argument with Disney.

Sure...there are only so many ways to design a box.
And every way has already been done.
So, even if I don't directly copy someone's template, I will still copy someone's previous box style.
And yet, I can still say "I designed a box".
But if I ignore designing altogether, and open the hidden files of copyrighted game,
and grab the mesh for a box shape and pop it into Pepakura to be unfolded...
this does not make me a box designer.

There is no manipulation or editing going on here.
He isn't changing the poses of these figures.
He goes into the game files and grabs the figure mesh in the pose he wants to use.

Even Pepakura Designer does not allow for that type of CGI manipulation.
And, we are assuming he has the "pro" version of Pepakura? Paid for it too?

Pepakura takes its own time to"unfold" a 3D model.
This is not "designing" or effort of any kind from the user.
All you do is wait for the magic to happen.

If I put bread into a Toaster and press the button, it comes out as toast.
All I did was wait.
Or, can I now call myself a "baker" because I stared at the Toaster while it toasted?

[lfuente]

Normally I don't wade into discussions like these as I'm not a copyright lawyer and I'm not looking for an argument, but I would just like to make a few points and that'll be the last anyone will hear from me about this.

1. The only people who are responsible for, and can make definitive policies regarding intellectual properties (IP) are the owners and their legal representatives, no one else.

2. The only person who knows for sure how much effort they put into a papercraft project is the one who did it, in this case Mr. Unfold Brazil (MUB). Reading many posts from aspiring modelers suggests that merely running a ripped mesh through an unfold program does not guarantee a buildable model (not just unfolded, but realistically buildable). The fact that he has finished models to display means he put in enough work to be successful.

Note that these are two completely separate issues!

Not picking a quarrel with you Dave, but you have taken positions on previous issues (like cats) that I would describe as confrontational, but people let you have your say because everyone is entitled to air their opinions. Since you used the term soapbox you should realize that others are entitled to use that same soapbox to air a different opinion.

I would like to see you extend the same courtesy you have received to others. If MUB is not a member of Papermodelers this means communicating with him directly, instead of posting criticism on a public forum where he has no chance of presenting his side.

Yes I am aware that game meshes are copyrighted and I don't support ripping them, but determining the degree of IP copyright violation is the exclusive right of the owners, see point 1. If they decide that your Koolwheelz violate fair use then you get slammed with the same copyright club you're swinging at MUB, even if neither of you make any money off those IPs.

I think the discussion has been sidetracked by the fact that the source mesh may come from a trademarked IP (none of us knows for sure unless you have been in touch with MUB, see point 2).

Thus the logical question for Dave is, if the source file was a 4-4-2 Atlantic steam engine from some open-source 3D mesh warehouse, textured to high standards as the famous Hiawatha then unfolded into a buildable model, would it be as easy to dismiss MUB's achievement as trivial and not worth the recognition that he seems to be asking for?

There is a difference between pointing out a product that is unethical, and insisting that no product is worth anything if it didn't start with a clean sheet.

And courtesy costs costs us nothing but restraint, or a few well chosen words.