Clarity regarding pirates...

**altomentis** · #1 07-29-2010, 12:52 PM

Hi,

I just want to make sure I understand what we consider a "pirate" site to be. Obviously someone selling models that are the work of someone else, e.g., selling Canon papercraft models as one's own or those of any of our revered model designers is piracy.

My question: what about models such as the ones on Site 42, which are from the 70s and 80s primarily, or the scans from Agence Eureka where the children's magazines are from dates later than 1923? Since she is not selling anything and usually identifies the source, I don't think of this as piracy, but I want to make sure the forum agrees. I love building some of the simple scenes and dioramas with their comic-book feel, but I will likely never find copies of "Mon Journal" or other vintage french children's magazines.

I have seen places that sell reproductions of Epinal models that are out of copyright, so does that mean that free/digital reproductions are piracy?

Basically, I want to make sure I understand what the lines are. Although I will scan and build a kit that I have bought, I would never offer those scans free or for a price to anyone, or sell multiple built models. I just scan because if I make an unrecoverable error, I haven't lost the opportunity to build the model. Or if fate is kind (or to be honest, I am confused about what I already own), I will buy two copies, one to build and one to keep.

Please keep me on the straight and narrow here.

Thanks, Christine

**2Kamser** · #2 07-29-2010, 01:56 PM

Hi Altomentis
i think the basics are as follows:
pirated models are when somebody sells someone else's work that the owner has not given any permission to them to sell - or make payable models accesible through free downlods

to scan your own model for backup is not to pirate, unless you keep the copy and then sell the original i.e. you get the model "for free"

about the old ones, i think they are ok as otherwise they would not be linked to from here - pirate site links are always removed if posted here

if in doubt PM one of the moderators and they can advise you

if i'm wrong in anything please correct me

**airdave** · #3 07-29-2010, 02:23 PM

Clarity regarding pirates...

well this is what I know:

hope that clears it up for everyone.

**airdave** · #4 07-29-2010, 02:26 PM

oh, and Christine, I have no issues with your take on "piracy" as you explained it!

**Jason** · #5 07-29-2010, 10:16 PM

I will weigh in on this one, and Rick will correct me if I am wrong, or more detail is needed. If you own the models, ie purchased it and want to scan it so you can modify it or use the scans to correct mistakes, that is fine. The key is that you own the original.

As to models that are out of print, old models, not published any more, that is a gray area, and so we ask that you not post them to the forum. The reason is simple, this is a hobby for everyone, and that included the moderators as well as myself. We do not want to have to figure out if it is an illegal copy, legal in certain countries but not in others. I can not remember if copy write is 50 years from last published, or from when the author dies unless renewed by their estate. You get the picture. Each country has different laws to cover copy write. So to make it easier to moderate the forum, we just ask that members do not post pictures or build for models they do not own the original. Will we make everyone prove that they own the original. No, that is beyond reasonable, but we ask that everyone abide by the rules.

I am not going to cover purchasing a reproduction or copy of a model that the seller does not have explicit permission as I feel that highly illegal.

If I missed something, please ask, and thanks for asking.

Jason

**SJPONeill** · #6 07-30-2010, 02:42 PM

Thanks, Jason

Could you also please clarify the situation regarding paper models derived from digital 3D models? there seems to be a distinction between someone who extracts a 3D model from a computer game (these generally being copyrighted) and turns it into a paper model which appears to be an accepted practice but the develop ment of a paper model from, for example, a 3D model from the Sketchup Warehouse does not seem to be accepted without clear permission from the original model designer.

**Lex** · #7 07-30-2010, 03:26 PM

In doubt, PM an admin. That's all there is... :o

**imavingalaughaswell** · #8 07-30-2010, 03:37 PM

I always love it when this topic comes up .....

my views on this are as follows... and please do not kick me out for this its just my own opinion...

If someone sells a free model that is not thier own ..PIRACY

If someone re-distributes a payed for model for free ... SHARING

If someone scans a model and sells the scan ..PIRACY

If someone scans a model and gives it away .. SHARING

My understanding of Piracy is copying something without permission and profiting from the sales of said item...

Piracy i don't agree with ,but as for sharing i'm all for it and see nothing wrong with it...

If however you are of the opinion that someone Sharing a model is commiting piracy,or the person dowloading it is commiting piracy,then look at it the way i do whenever this comes up ....

You buy a newspaper on you way home from work to read on the bus,when you get of the bus you leave the paper behind for someone else to read as you have finished with it .... are you then commiting piracy? or is the person who picks it up to read it next commiting piracy?

another example..

You buy a CD and make a copy of it,if you sell the copy to someone its PIRACY,if however you give it to someone then its not.. as you are not making any profit from it.

okies thats my views ...

**Barry** · #9 07-30-2010, 03:50 PM

I have always wanted to ask what do you create that you share but I do enjoy you sharing your twisted logic in an effort to not be a pirate. At least be honest with yourself and admit you enjoy being one and taunting the people you rip off when they can do nothing back to you or retaliate.

Do have a good day enjoy being clever and not having the courage to write your real name

**rickstef** · #10 07-30-2010, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imavingalaughaswell

If someone sells a free model that is not thier own ..PIRACY

If someone re-distributes a paid for model for free ... SHARING

If someone scans a model and sells the scan ..PIRACY

If someone scans a model and gives it away .. SHARING

2 out of 4 you are right, on the other two you are wrong,

As soon as you do something in which the original copyright holder does not get compensated, it is piracy.

Now, if said copyright holder explicitly states that sharing is allowed, then you are free and clear to share, but in any other method, you are not.

Quote:

another example..

You buy a CD and make a copy of it,if you sell the copy to someone its PIRACY,if however you give it to someone then its not.. as you are not making any profit from it.

Technically this is still piracy, but is hard to enforce.

and those are my two bits