PaperModelers.com

Go Back   PaperModelers.com > Designers Corner > Future, Current, and Past design projects > Marlab Miniboats Projects

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 09-13-2011, 07:37 AM
paperairforce paperairforce is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 195
Total Downloaded: 0
Fascinating process Dr. and i am following with great interest. The details are great, and the windier the better for me!

I must admit to some confusion as well though - are these going to be made into actual working research vessels made of card and waterproofed? Or will working boats be made of other material? Or are these just for rc recreation?

As for additional equipment....in my part of the world...if the USCG wants to board, you must have fire extinguisher, working horn, 360 degree lights, and signal flares ( they won't be so unreasonable as to expect life preservers on an unmanned drone I expect but you never know
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09-13-2011, 09:40 AM
DrGerryD DrGerryD is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 75
Total Downloaded: 0
Hi Paperairforce

The CardCat X900 is a miniboat so I won't be building a bigger version. It has certainly become something that I had not intended and I guess that for monitoring the environment in streams and nature reservations where wildlife is sensitive to man, it may be put to good use. So it has become a product in its own right, built in cardboard just as you are seeing it here on the thread. The CardCat X200 was too small for this job, so it has been relegated to test status. By that I mean that new principles and ideas can be carried out on the CardCat X200 before being transferred to the X900. I have built 2 CardCat X200 (incomplete hulls since both are lacking the deck hatches) for this very purpose.

Mind you the experiences I have gained building the CardCat X200 and the CardCat X900 have certainly affected the design of the original X200 full size boat (2m LOA) which I was about to build but which will now be delayed until spring at the earliest. It is autumn here and my asthma prevents me from working in the larger workshop. As yet there is no heating and electrical system in it. Last time I worked out there in autumn I ended up in intensive and a ventilator for 3 months. Never again. The great part about building the CardCat X900 is that I can do it in my office behind the kitchen. The only negative part is that my kittens Eek and Lille My find it a wonderful place to play.. :D

Ok on the Coast Guard requirements. Not relevant for the CardCat X900, but definitely for the X200 as it is a sea-going boat. But you raise an interesting question. How would the authorities over there view the use of a cardboard boat like the CardCat X900 in nature reservations ? Also your mention of lights gave me the idea that the CardCat X900 can have a blitz light installed so it can easily be located if there is trouble of one kind or another. a blitz flash can be seen a long way off, doesn't weigh much and does not use power when not being used. A feasible idea.

Generally speaking seperating the cardboard boats from the "real" boats is easy once you know how (isn't that always the case in life?) The cardboard boats are always referred to as CardCat X200 or CardCat X900. "Real" boats do not have the "CardCat" in front of the name. At the moment for example I have an almost complete 1800mm "Island Carrier" built in 4mm Meranti and ready for equipping in the main workshop. I can't afford to equip it being on a pension and all, so it will have to wait until I can. If I made a cardboard version it would be named "CardCat Island Carrier". That boat is a landing craft made to carry a remote controlled terrain-going vehicle. The boat acts also as a more powerful relay station for rc/signals and for wireless webcam to the more lightly equipped land vehicle, which cannot carry large enough transmitters to reach the operator station. It is a large but relatively simple boat (apart for the stern and bow loading ramps which are also rc). I don't need to tell you what that combination can be used for.

Today I carried out float and load tests on the CardCat X200 hull. Photo enclosed. It worked very well indeed. The tests showed that I can easily use normal oil paint on the hull and don't need to use epoxy like I do on the X200. Certainly good news, especially for my lungs while working indoors.. ;D The hull was designed to carry a max load of 1000g and it did without any apparent deformation whatsoever. I guess it is strong enough even though built in 0.65mm card. The CardCat X900 hull should be capable of supporting a full load of around 17Kg with an own weight of around 2Kg.

Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-13-2011, 10:56 AM
rbeach84's Avatar
rbeach84 rbeach84 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Norfolk, VA - USA
Posts: 1,022
Total Downloaded: 87.11 MB
Dr. G, your posts beg the question of why you are using such inferior materials to build your drone boat? If, for example, you were to use corrugated plastic sheet instead (a material commonly used here in the States for cheap signage), you'd have a two ply material that was weld-bonded to it's internal webs, relatively easy to cut, especially with a heated blade or wire, but otherwise tough in the projected environment. Painted to protect from UV damage, it would be very durable. I used a 4 foot by 3 foot section, unpainted, for about three years as a sun-shade for a window mounted air conditioner unit before it started 'falling apart'. Painted, it might have lasted forever. Bends along the axis of the webs is no problem - can even be used as a hinge. One more thought: with the open edges of the 'web' sealed or filled with polyurethane foam, you have built in bouyancy.

This is one link for a supplier from a Google search, just so you can see what I'm talking about:
Advantages of Coroplast Corrugated Plastic Containers | Coroplast

Cheers!
__________________
Regards, Robert
In Work: Uhu02 Tinkerbell - [under Tapcho's thread] Tinkerbell - a fairy with an attitude
Nobi Junkers SRF BETA build - BETA Build: Nobi's Junkers SRF 1:48 scale
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 09-13-2011, 11:43 AM
DrGerryD DrGerryD is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 75
Total Downloaded: 0
Hi Robert

Thanks for the comment, the link, and the question. I know thermoplastic sheeting with foam very well and have used it before in parts of some of my larger designs (35m Baltic Princess passenger ferry for example).

Cardboard as a building material other than for display purposes was totally unknown to me prior to this project. I am in a position now where I can follow those research directions which I find interesting and do not need to design for a living. I have decided to try out cardboard for construction.

At the moment I am still on a learning curve with the material. I want to see how far it can go and whether it can be used for anything serious. That is the only reason that I am working with cardboard - but at the same time the best reason from a designer point of view. I am having real fun with it so far and that is another reason for using it. And then there is the ecological reason. Thermoplastic with foam is not nearly as environmentally friendly as paper/cardboard. Last but not least the financial side. Cardboard is significantly cheaper to make, work with and dispose of than plastic. Those are major factors that influence me at the moment.

Cheers
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09-15-2011, 05:58 PM
DrGerryD DrGerryD is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 75
Total Downloaded: 0
Hi Guys

The CardCat X900 port and starboard hulls are now complete, apart from the forward sections of the Centre Line Longitudinals, which can first be added when I am ready for plating. Everything looks fine so now I progress to the bridge between them.

Reply With Quote
Google Adsense
  #16  
Old 09-19-2011, 08:26 PM
DrGerryD DrGerryD is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 75
Total Downloaded: 0
Smile

Hi guys

I got some really shocking news - of the positive kind - yesterday so I am all over the place today. 33 years ago I was an officer in the Brit Merchant Navy for a period of 3 years. During that time I was in the officers pension scheme. I forgot all about it until last month when they contacted me and told me I could draw my pension now that I am turned 60. I thought - right, there's probably about 20 in it. But I applied and yesterday the statement of benefits turned up. Took me a while to get off the floor. Now I will be able to buy that laser cutter I thought I would never ever see in a month of sundays. Will be able to start a very small business with cutting and engraving, glass etc - but more importantly can make kits of the miniboats I have been designing.... Chaos theory in action .... a thirty year old forgotten decision comes to play a vital role in my and Henny's future (she asked for a course in using it for cutting patchwork patterns and of course I agreed), The funds will not turn up for another month and there are practical things to do before then, but hey - that's part of the dream..
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09-19-2011, 09:52 PM
DrGerryD DrGerryD is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 75
Total Downloaded: 0
The CardCat X900 Stealth Drone frame is complete. Will be starting work on the engine selection and frame adaptions today.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 09-20-2011, 07:35 PM
DrGerryD DrGerryD is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 75
Total Downloaded: 0
Hi Guys

I have been looking into the drive chain for the CardCat X900 today and have chosen to go with parts available from Robbe.

1) Kort Nozzle with special 65mm plastic props (left and right rotating)
2) 200mm stern tube
3) Double universal coupling
4) 12v 8A electric motor (abt. 1/8 BHP)

There will of course be two sets since the CardCat X900 is a catamaran.

Unfortunately the specifications do not have detailed drawings included so the adaption of the engine rooms for this combination will have to wait until I have the parts in hand (may be a couple of weeks). That means that I am unable to add the engine room plating. So I will start the plating from the engine room bulkhead and move forward. Now that the operating voltage is fixed at 12v I will be able to select the right battery during this process.

And now for something completely different. I guess that when development of the CardCat X900 is over and the laser cutter arrives and allows me to make kits in polyester or pvc plate, then I will be asked to find another forum since they will not be in cardboard. Any suggestions ?

Cheers
Gerry
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 09-21-2011, 04:24 AM
DrGerryD DrGerryD is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 75
Total Downloaded: 0
Hi Guys

Okay. Today I started on plating of the CardCat X900. However, I stopped again and evaluated the material. I have so far used 500 staples on holding this boat together and it looks absolutely terrible - like Frankenstein's monster with stitches all over. I reappraised the project over coffee and have come to realise that I have stepped over the limit as to what the material can handle. The disability of carboard over 1mm thick to stay together is of course the main cause of this. As far as I can see, cardboard upto 1mm can be used if not coated as it appears to have another density. The manufacturing process for cardboard over 1mm is apparently very different. This limits the use of cardboard as a building material to small models under about 300mm in length. Additionally, cardboard over 1mm thick is impossible to bend without damage, limiting designs to SLO, which in itself is not pretty at all even though technically feasible.

I am not into boats under about 1000 mm and at this size the result is not acceptable. Additionally, since I expect very soon to obtain a laser cutter which can handle a vast array of other non-metal materials, this leads me to place greater demands on the materials I will be using in the CardCat X900, and will undoubtedly lead to big changes in the design, which I expect firstly to lengthen to 1000mm and secondly to drop the SLO and go to the original elliptical shaped hull of the class version of the CardCat X200. I am discussing materials with Raboesch in Holland, especially Lexan (also unknown to me), forming of 2mm PVC and Polyester sheets, and recommended glues.

What does this mean ? It means that I do not recommend cardboard for construction of boats over 300mm. At this length the cardboard thickness should not exceed 1mm. The cardboard should be uncoated. It also means that I am stopping the use of cardboard in my boats.

Cheers
Gerry
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 09-23-2011, 04:03 AM
DrGerryD DrGerryD is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 75
Total Downloaded: 0
Hi Guys

I have two kittens, Eek and Lille My and they love playing about in the workshop/office. What does this have to do with cardboard boats ? You can see the result of a kitten attrack on the X900 hull frame below. The move away from cardboard to polyester proved to be wise..

On that score I am still digging around with the technical installation. When I am done then I guess I will move the new boat to my web site as cardboard will not be involved. I have certainly enjoyed my time here and am recommending this site on my web site at the next update for cardboard/paper modelers.

Reply With Quote
Google Adsense
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:50 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Parts of this site powered by vBulletin Mods & Addons from DragonByte Technologies Ltd. (Details)
Copyright © 2007-2023, PaperModelers.com