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Old 07-16-2021, 12:28 PM
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paper type experience: glossy vs opaque

good evening everybody.
if necessary ... move this thread to another site.)

I suppose it is easy to answer ... everyone recommends a type of paper, type of thickness, grams ... etc for each model, and piece in particular ... especially if it is small (thinner), and if it is larger it will be thicker .. (or have an inner support)

but because I don't know any of that, the printers that I know are not interested ... and besides being expensive here, I only use the common A4 or A3 paper
(and to give it "thickness", I previously glued layers and layers of the same paper, until I get the strongest thickness, depending on which piece obviously)

But the important question that I rarely see is
Do you use glossy paper?(photographic type)

in race cars, I use that type of paper on the entire upper chassis ... it gives it a very shiny finish ... and on the lower parts, interiors, and wheels I use the most common "rough" paper. you really can tell the difference. you can see the "texture" of an opaque wheel, unlike the shiny "metal" (photo paper) ...

but, according to my experience ... it is THE MOST DIFFICULT to handle ... I explain:
-the common paper (matte, opaque, common, rough) "absorbs-binds" the ink, then, when folded, the ink stays in place.
When sticking rough pieces, the glue grip is excellent.

-the photographic paper (or a VERY smooth, glossy one) does not absorb the ink ... it is only printed on top ... so when folding it, it "cracks" it has white lines appearing. (This can be solved by painting the lines ... but it is very dangerous for the model ... in the end it tends to have cracks like old oil paint ... if there is moisture, it is worse)
Besides sticking shiny pieces together, you have to wait a long time to be sure that they are firmly glued.
(Also, keep in mind that if you glued 2 shiny pieces with paint on top ... you only glued the "paint against paint" ... not the paper ... this is usually "weak" structurally)

According to model, and way of folding (round or "squares") I can dare to gloss paper.

to the corresponding subject, in the "space", the shuttle, the ET, and the srb ... all are "rough" or without shine.
Except for the csm apollo, and the "golden" of the LM ... or any satellite that has that golden metallic protection.
almost any rocket is matte ... especially at launch ... (cryogenic gas, ice sheets on the skin ... etc)
(only if it is saved, you can see if it shines or not)

as a "reference" my modified F-40 in its "dustproof box."

paper type experience: glossy vs opaque-20210713_100351.jpg
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  #2  
Old 07-18-2021, 01:40 PM
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asettico asettico is offline
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In the Download section, under "Self Help Library" you can find different tutorial about different techniques.
The only suggestion I can give you is that you can scratch the surface just before gluing the area that will receive the glue, in order to reach the paper, not just the inked surface.
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Old 07-18-2021, 03:00 PM
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I use lots of glossy and semigloss (photo) paper. They represent the textures of rockets a lot better than regular paper.

Glossy photo paper is glueable, you just need to roughen up the glue side with sandpaper. Just a little, not too much. Also, I glue my photo paper with CA (super glue), which is quick, and also can glue your fingers together if not carefully used, but it also holds glosy paper up well. Photo paper should not be folded sharply. it just is too thick. In such a case, it is much better to cut the parts and glue the backside to a V-shaped glue strip and re-attach the parts. You can 'round' them afterwards with an embossing tool. (small ball on a stick)

Thick paper is hard to fold nicely. It always creases. Best way is to use a humid cotton swab and stoke the back and then bend it. No creases. This needs some practice.


People like David Hanners (and me) like to use lots of different paper types in one build, especially when scratch building, it is essential to get a nice array of textures in a model, I think. This also needs lots of practice and knowledge of paper, and some intuitive feeling on how paper reacts to rolling, bending, folding.
Thickness of paper is VERY important. 80 gram usually is too thin and not at all sturdy, it buckles and is not able to carry a lot of weight. 160 or 180 gram is best for model building, sometimes a little thicker is required. 200 gram, 220 gram, maybe. It often is mentioned on model sheets on which thickness it needs to be printed. If you use thicker paper than mentioned, things will not fit. Trust me on that one. (experience.) For golden or silvery insulation, I just use chocolate wrappers in that colour. I also collected all sorts of coloured and metallic paper for that purpose. I have quite a cabinet full of paper for scratch building. Glueing layers of paper together to obtain a certain thickness is not convenient, it will always buckle and look messy.

As far as the Shuttle stack goes, I can recommend to take a look at my build or at David Hanners' stack. The shuttle is matte, thats true. But the boosters really are (semi)gloss. The insulation bands around them are matte. I rather use semigloss because gloss it too shiny and a little unrealistic. The ET is matte and in reality it has a very rough surface. The foam is thick and irregular in shape. I just used brown paper which I sanded to make it fuzzy and more matte. It gives the right feel.
And that is where I aim at. Not realism in the sense of every tile needs to be correct, every colour needs to be 100% spot on, I go for atmosphere. The model needs to feel right. At 1/100 0r 1/96, the model is virtually 100 times further away from you than you have it standing in front of you. That means the feeling needs to be good, not the amount of rivets.

Hey, Craft, you know what is important? Just build stuff. Planes, rockets, cars, ships, birds, whatever. Build. Build, build, build. Ask questions when you really encounter an obstacle. But build and learn while building. Sometimes things will sove itseld when you look at them and suddenly you see how to do somethint or how to fit something. Experience is everything. We can tell you all sorts of stuff, but you have to do it. YOU make the models. You need to get the hang of it. Every start is hard, every first model won't look the way you would like it to be. It is all in your hands. And while doing it, it will improve.
Do not immediately expect museum quality models. Start with smaller stuff, easier stuff to get more into the swing of things.
We're here to help and to form some kind of global community here. But you also need to just do the stuff to get the hang of it.
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Old 07-19-2021, 08:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paper Kosmonaut View Post
Hey, Craft, you know what is important? Just build stuff. Planes, rockets, cars, ships, birds, whatever. Build. Build, build, build. Ask questions when you really encounter an obstacle. But build and learn while building. Sometimes things will sove itseld when you look at them and suddenly you see how to do somethint or how to fit something. Experience is everything. We can tell you all sorts of stuff, but you have to do it. YOU make the models. You need to get the hang of it. Every start is hard, every first model won't look the way you would like it to be. It is all in your hands. And while doing it, it will improve.
Do not immediately expect museum quality models. Start with smaller stuff, easier stuff to get more into the swing of things.
We're here to help and to form some kind of global community here. But you also need to just do the stuff to get the hang of it.

I still recommend the little Canon free models to get started. Very good to learn technique. The one-page pet figures teach you how to deal with curved organic shapes, and the architecture pieces help to learn how to keep straight things straight. And even if you mess up, they are cute enough that you can always find someone to give them to.
Paper Craft - Canon Creative Park
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Old 07-19-2021, 08:46 PM
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I still recommend the little Canon free models to get started.
Well, results may vary, but my first actual paper model was a 1/96th Saturn 1 (SA-1), which I still have and like, my second model in fact actually was a Canon, but the Jaguar Mk.2. With which I might have gotten a little - or more ahead of myself. I finished it and it looked reasonable, but man, I wouldn't recommend it for a beginner. I learnt a lot of it, though. It gave me callus. I built it in a week's time.
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Old 07-19-2021, 09:06 PM
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I was talking about the 'beginner' models. There have been so many people that show their first builds here of things I wouldn't attempt even now. But I still think for the average builder, it is better to learn how paper and glue work, than to dive into the hard stuff right from the start
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Old 07-20-2021, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Vermin_King View Post
I was talking about the 'beginner' models. There have been so many people that show their first builds here of things I wouldn't attempt even now. But I still think for the average builder, it is better to learn how paper and glue work, than to dive into the hard stuff right from the start
True, maybe. But not everyone is into building paper pets or other silly looking paper stuff for that matter just to learn how paper models work.

I got into paper models because I was disappointed in plastic models. Their price, the lack of detail, the expensive after-market sets, the smell of the glue and the paints. I discovered the large amount of other models and just dove straight in.
I bit off a lot, but not more than I could chew. I had not yet discovered this forum. But I wouldn't have liked to have started out with a kawaii paper pig, cow or cat. It just isn't my thing. I guess it's the same for Craft.
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Old 07-20-2021, 07:59 PM
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As such, precisely the price (unpayable here), the time, the tools, everything in general of the plastic models ... makes it look like a very "full" hobby. on paper you simply dare and the only thing you spend is paper ... and if you do it well, it looks very good .. also ... simply many "out of pride" we do not start simply models ... (in my case , I went for the most difficult) and so I "tanned"
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Old 07-21-2021, 11:11 AM
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But I agree with Vermin King that to gain experience a little fooling around with simpler models does really get you going. And you'll get the hang of it a lot easier.
That said, The Saturn V and the Fortezza Shuttle are the other end of that spectrum. Take it slow. No one is hurrying you up.
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Old 07-21-2021, 11:24 AM
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to the user Vermin_King, even so, you're right ... canon models or any other that has a simple and easy "style", but that looks really good ... they are an excellent start in papercraft.
(That said, starting with a puppy would be more like a little sister)

.. it is also true .. I suffered horrors to finish models considered difficult. (subaru impreza 06, and lancia delta hf ... really, really knew the word "patience") .. but in a few models and months I learned a lot. and even with tenacity the models ended up being quite "normal" according to my criteria.

the other problem is the size ... I think we are all a little "irresponsible" and first we think about making the model bigger ... and then we think about where we keep it.
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